Does ESPN Censor Their Writers?/ Can They?

by Adam T on Jan 4, 2008 2:54 PM CST in News Comment 32 comments

Ok, this article is not really about censorship, but if you needed any more reason to hate on Len Pasquarelli, then this could be it. Lenny has released his All-Pro Team. For the most part I know what to expect, so I just scroll down to the Special Teams section to read the Devin Hester portion. To my surprise I see this:

Josh Cribbs (Cleveland): It's always hard to choose against Chicago's Devin Hester, who already ranks as one of the great return specialists of all time. But the electrifying Cribbs led the league in kickoff return average and was in the top five in punt return average as well.

Now, I like Cribbs. He is one hell of a return man and fun to watch, but he can't be serious. His reasoning of Cribbs leading the league in kickoffs and punt return yards is valid if the other guy wasn't Hester. Of course Cribbs leads the league in yards, nobody kicks to Hester. Is he just trying to be controversial and get people to read his stuff?

If you want accurate punt and kick off yard stats, then you have to give Hester all the yards he should have got when the ball was kicked to the 40. If he lines up on the 10 and the ball goes to the 40, then he gets at least 35 yards to his total. Every time he scares a punter into kicking the ball 15 yards and out of bounds, he has to get that yardage. No offense to Cribbs, but their is only one returner that is keeping coaches up at night. Devin Hester is single handedly making coaches around the league look stupid, if they even consider putting the ball in his general direction.

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Huh?

Is this a fucking a joke? He can't be serious. What an asshole. There's no way he can seriously believe that.

GO BEARS!!!!!

by McRipper on Jan 4, 2008 3:25 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Returns?

How many more returns did Cribbs have over Hester? Anybody know?

GO BEARS!!!!!

by McRipper on Jan 4, 2008 3:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Answer:

Cribbs had 59 kickoff returns for 1809 return yards (30.7 avg). Hester had 43 kickoff returns for 934 return yards (21.7 avg).

I did not watch many Washington games, and do not recall if teams intentionally kicked short on him. I would doubt it though as 49 of his 59 returns were over 20+ yards. I know for a fact that Hester's average would have been over 30 yards per had teams kicked straight away to him on all 43 of those kickoffs.

As for punts, Hester's average punt return was 15.5 with 4 TDs (651 yards on 42 returns). That was second behind Roscoe Parrish who had 16.3 avg with 1 TD (440 yards on 27 returns). Once again, though, I doubt teams kicked away from Roscoe Parrish. Cribbs was 4th at 13.5 avg with 1 TD (405 yards on 30 returns). All three had similar numbers for 20+ yards % and 40+ yards %, Hester with slight edge in latter and Roscoe with slight edge in former.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats;jsessionid=DAEAE8A38F9D6F2CD09370D2D16CCD6F?season=2007&s easonType=REG&d-447263-o=2&tabSeq=0&statisticCategory=KICK_RETURNS&d-447263-p=1& d-447263-s=PUNT_RETURNS_AVERAGE_YARDS&d-447263-n=1

Just the facts, ma'am. Not making any argument.

by mikebdot on Jan 4, 2008 3:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Correction

I should have said I haven't watched many Cleveland games. In fact, I've watched exactly 0 of them.

by mikebdot on Jan 4, 2008 3:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

what a fool

here's the difference:

You don't want to kick to Cribbs
You don't kick to Hester

Devin Hester has transformed the entire Special Teams of the NFL. He is (and I'm not overstating it) the Michael Jordan of special teams. It's the same way that MJ transformed the NBA.

by Chad on Jan 4, 2008 3:43 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Hahahahaha!!!!!!

This IS a fucking joke. I seriously laughed my ass off at that line. AWESOME 'expertise', Len!

Insightful analysis yet again from ESPN. Sports paparazzi douchebaggery AT ITS FINEST!!!!

I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something. - Dick Butkus

by iowaBear on Jan 4, 2008 3:59 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

stats

Kickoff returns:

Cribbs: 30.1 yards/return (1st), 2 TDs (tied for 3rd)
Hester: 21.7 yards/return (35th), 2 TDs (tied for 3rd)

Punt returns:

Cribbs: 13.5 yards/return (3rd), 1 TD (tied for 2nd with 14 others)
Hester: 15.5 yards/return (2nd), 4 TDs (1st... no one else had more than one)

By the numbers you could make a legitimate argument for Cribbs. Unfortunately that completely ignores how teams changed their game plan specifically for Hester. It ignores that teams did not send kickoffs deep to Hester, limiting his ability to have a better yards/return average.

visit the mindful mission.

by big_lowitzki on Jan 4, 2008 4:00 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Other Stats

To get a better perspective on things, they should be looking at statistics showing how the team fared after a punt or kickoff, instead of just individual stats that mask the way teams schemed around a playmaker like Hester.

What was the average net yards on a punt sent to Hester vs. Cribbs? What was the average starting position of the Bears vs. the Browns after a kickoff?

I can't answer those questions, but if someone could, it would certainly shed some more light on the subject.

by DPappy on Jan 4, 2008 4:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

im pretty sure

browns fans would agree hester is better than cribbs

by Jbasic89 on Jan 5, 2008 12:37 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

It's not that insane

I know Hester is amazing. He's the best of all time. But Cribbs is a weapon in his own right and then there is the part where he covers kicks and was one of Cleveland's better special teams tacklers. Cribbs plays all phases of Special Teams and that has to count for something. If you were just picking a returner of course it'd be Hester, but the other things Cribbs brings to the table means I can understand the case he's making.

They pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. *That's* the *Chicago* way!

by 2ndcitydiehard on Jan 5, 2008 2:42 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Understandable

But think how many TD's he would've had if teams actually kicked to him. He could've had 10 returns this season. When you take into consideration that he played all phases of ST, then the arguement carries some weight. But then you have to take into consideration the fact that teams didn't kick to Hester. BTW, I don't think I would have Cribbs on coverage. He's too good a returner to risk injury. Remember when Winslow broke his leg his rookie season on ST coverage?

GO BEARS!!!!!

by McRipper on Jan 5, 2008 8:34 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

pure shock value

The choice makes no sense and it is purely for shock value. Same exact thing as how it takes a 16-0 season for the best coach to be named coach of the year. Most years, they may as well name it the "Surprise Team of the Year" award. If the Patriots would have gone 15-1, bet your ass it would have been Mike McCarthy as coach of the year just because the Packers were the surprise.

Still though, you could make the case that Hester was the equivilent of a 16-0 season, something that has never been seen before....so even still the choice is ridiculous.

by Ando on Jan 5, 2008 2:51 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

SI.com and Peter King did the same thing

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/peter_king/12/30/week17/5.html

KR/PR: Josh Cribbs, Cleveland. Top five NFL punt- and kick-returner, and he was Steve Tasker all season as a pursuit man.

by RME JICO on Jan 5, 2008 7:46 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Keul Kidz

Haven't you guys figured out that journalists have the same mentality has 8th grade clicks.
Name any position in the NFL and you can name 3 to 4 players that are arguably the best. I would take Hester over all the other kick returners, but Cribbs is pretty damn good.

Some of you actually think the Bears should resign Rex Grossman and I think your nuts. Change, change change! Change is good.

by phastphil on Jan 5, 2008 8:52 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Greatest ever vs. anyone else?

You simply cannot take anyone else over the greatest ever. This is like when the press got tired of voting Jordan the MVP of the NBA every year.

-$uchM@N!

by suchman on Jan 5, 2008 10:29 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

WTF!!!!!

These fucking morons!!! Can someone explain to me why kick coverage has anything to do with KR/PR? There is never a point in which the KR/PR covers kicks. If you want to call him a Special Teams Player of the year that is one thing but covering kicks well does not a KR/PR make!!!!

by Chad on Jan 5, 2008 12:54 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

this is how u know they dont mean what they write

Offensive Rookie: Joe Thomas, T, Cleveland. No disrespect to Adrian Peterson, but for 16 games, Thomas was more impactful on the Browns than Peterson was on Minnesota.

by Jbasic89 on Jan 5, 2008 1:00 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Crunching some numbers

Our average starting field position after a kickoff was the 35 yardline.
Opposing punters averaged a 32.8 yard net punt against us.

I still have to work out the equivalent numbers for Cribbs/Cleveland.

--Torch

by torch on Jan 5, 2008 1:05 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

As it turns out

Cribbs/Cleveland has similar numbers for opponents net punting and average kickoff field position. The differences are decimal places neglible.

Both returned 2 kickoffs for TDs. However, Hester had a 4-1 advantage in punt returns for TDs.

Here's a bigger stat of how much more coaches schemed for Hester vs. Cribbs:

Teams punted out of bounds 24 times and put kickoffs out of bounds 8 times against Chicago.
They only punted out of bounds 7 times and never kicked off out of bounds against Cleveland.

--Torch

by torch on Jan 5, 2008 3:06 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

twice as many tds

in less touches.

by Chad on Jan 5, 2008 3:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Who's the Cheesehead moron?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3182557

Brady gets 49 of 50 votes for MVP, Favre gets the other. Moron.

Visit The Cub Reporter (mvn.com/mlb-cubs)

by thecubreporter on Jan 6, 2008 11:49 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Mendenhall to the draft

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3182506

Visit The Cub Reporter (mvn.com/mlb-cubs)

by thecubreporter on Jan 6, 2008 11:51 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

God, I hope they don't take a RB...

...in the first round. That would pretty much be the dumbest thing ever. (Not that you were implying the Bears would.) Damn, that would be stupid.

by tyger1147 on Jan 6, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

why?

You also have to realize that most NFL teams believe in the "best available athlete" draft. And I agree with it most time. The only time to not do that is when you have a glaring hole and that can be filled by picking the second or third best option.

I know the Bears need a lot of help in other areas. I think we would all agree that the Bears need to upgrade the O-line. But if Mendenhall is the best available player, then take him.

by Chad on Jan 6, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

No.

That's stupid. They have glaring holes that can be filled by picking the second or third best option.

Plus, if they really want a running back, there are free agents. Should they still draft Mendenhall after they just signed Michael Turner? Or, if they've resigned Lance Briggs and a linebacker is the best athlete available, they should draft him?

No, unless the player is an elite talent, you don't draft one when it's the 4th (I think 6th) biggest need on the team. There will be comparable players to Mendenhall (I actually have no idea how good he is, I'm just assuming he's 1st round since that's what his coach said) that might not be as good, but would be close, and would fill a need (QB, O-Line, Safety, etc.)

Unless, of course, they can trade Benson for a 2nd round pick or an established o-lineman or safety.

by tyger1147 on Jan 6, 2008 2:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

look

the point is moot because I don't think Mendenhall is going in the first round. We'll see what happens in the combines. If he shines, he'll move up but there is going to be a few good running backs in this draft.

But regardless of that, I am telling you that NFL GMs don't draft the way you would like. They draft by best available talent. If the best available is a offensive lineman, they will pick him. If its a qb they will pick him. And if the best available player is a running back, they will pick him.

by Chad on Jan 6, 2008 2:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

mock yahoo draft

couple days ago had him going as the last pick, I would be sort of suprised to see that. wouldn't be a bad second round pick if we somehow already managed to get 2 lineman and a safety, and one of the qb prospects didn't fall to us. although if they resign grossman i don't really see them drafting another kid.

"Kyle Orton and Jack Daniel's could be the greatest songwriting duo since Rodgers and Hammerstein." - DJ Gallo

by mike b on Jan 6, 2008 3:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs