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Proof JA reads WCG!

I told you guys that JA better watch out and here is the proof that he was paying attention.  About 80% of the off season moves mentioned were made out of these two articles.  The ones he didn't make are the ones that are going to haunt him.

The only things he did not do was:

-sign a free agent OL (He'll regret that)

-sign Michael Turner (Obviously he would be nice to have now, we probably would have drafted another OL if that were the case or a QB.  I'm happy to have Forte, but we needed the extra pick.)

-sign Berrian (he should have been franchised so we could have 2 drafts to find a replacement, but we'll move forward)

-I may have missed the boat on Rueben Brown

-I couldn't find it, but somewhere I posted about cutting/trading Ricky Manning, Jr.

-He should of traded Benson, now we got nothing

How much better would this season look with a FA G, Berrian, Turner, and possibly Brohm at backup QB.  The only thing I couldn't say for sure is whether we would have been able to resign, Briggs & Harris which were very important.  I'm pretty sure we would of had the cap space, but maybe the owners didn't want to spend that much.

________________________________________________________________

 

 

Cut or Trade Immediatel - Jan 7, 2008

 Personally, I think we have learned all we need to know about a few of our players.

Benson is a very expensive backup running back. Trade him immediately and save his salary to put toward someone else.  I would love to see us go hard after Michael Turner.  I do realize that it won't be easy to trade him, but we need to do whatever it takes.  Give some dough up to to get rid of him and get a 3rd round pick or something.

Moose served his purpose, but is now old, slow and only catches the ball when life is good.  Anyone remember the Orton season.  The guy couldn't catch a cold.  There were signs of that this year too. He played well last year and was a mentor this year.  We don't need him anymore.  He commands too high of a salary and only plays well when the offense is good.  Cut or trade.  I don't know how the penalties toward the cap work on a cut, but he is taking time away from Bradley, Davis, and Hester who all are fast and could actually break off a big play.

Fred Miller has to go.  Someone has to take the fall for this line and Fred you are the man.  I remember watching the Giant game and seeing 4 straight plays a guy running right you and not even being touched.  Hello you block for a living.  I don't know if he is hurt, but I think the writing is on the wall and his career is over.  Oh and the penalties this guy racked up.  Get rid of this guy, way too much salary.  

Adam Archaletta was a huge mistake.  The guy can't cover a pass.  He hits pretty well when in position, but how many times was he out of position. Then he missed so many big tackles.  That was suppose to be a strength of his.  This was the worst move we have made in the last 3 years.  Wasted money.  It even ended up costing Chris Harris.  Bye, bye, Adam.  Good luck at your next stop.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Angelo Better Watch Out! - Jan 8, 2008

Jerry I hope you're reading this.  This would be my approach to this year;s off-season. Jerry if your bosses see this they may offer me a job for my clever use of draft picks, free agency moves, and financial decisions.  If you use them though, I won't tell.  

Here's 10 things I would do to put this team in position to bounce back.

  1. I would sign Grossman to a incentive based deal.  If he does well, he see the money, if not he becomes a decent backup QB.
  2. Give Orton a chance to compete for the job.  He's not pretty but he doesn't turn the ball over.  His pocket presence was decent.  Hopefully, he can learn not to lock in on one receiver and improve his accuracy.
  3. Trade Benson for a 3rd round pick or better and/or Moose for a 4th round pick or better.
  4.  Acquire Michael Turner!  This is so huge I can't even describe how much.  This would be the #1 goal.  If we can't get Turner, look for a value pick at RB in either the 3rd or 4th round.
  5.  Cut Fred Miller and pick up two new good offensive lineman. Definitely pick-up one through free agency and two if possible.  If not draft one in the first round.  If we pick up two through free agency, then trade the #1 pick for more picks or draft a QB if available, or safety, or RB (I love Mendenhall being an Illinois fan).
  6.  Draft a safety day 1, but also make an attempt at Atogwe from St. Louis.  The guy is a stud and realistically we probably couldn't get him, but at least I would explore the option.
  7. Sign Bernard if he is being reasonable or else let him go.  Honestly, he could be very good, but his inconsistency isn't worth the big bucks.
  8. Sign Briggs if he will give us a hometown discount.  I don't see this happening.  He obviously care about the Benjamins, but I think it is worth it to offer him a good deal, but not an outstanding deal.  If not thank him for his contributions and let him go as well.
  9. Sign Rueben Brown and Brendon  Ayenbedajo.  Rueben will sign cheap and I believe Brendon wants to stay.  He may get a little more than desired, but he is a valuable leader to our special teams.  This is the year of saying good bye if anyone tries to break the bank.
  10. Finally, make the smartest move of the off-season and make sure that we sign Hester to a huge contract now.  The guy is getting faster every second.  I think he hits 88 mph, travels into the future, checks to see where all the players are going to be during the kick-offs, then comes back to the present, and blows our minds.  How much do you think he is going to be worth if he gets any better at all as a receiver?  He's already priceless, sign him before he takes every dime we own.
Final notes to the sceptics:  Realistically we need to prepare for the future at QB and RB, but I really believe that improving the line is more important this year.  I think QB's and RB's will perform significantly better with an improved line.  It would be nice to get a QB in the draft this year, but I wouldn't be opposed to waiting one more year if the right guy wasn't there.  

I think we will be fine at DT with Harris, Dvoracek, Adams, and the guy we got from Cincy's practice squad.  I would consider a second day pick at this position and also WR if we loose Berrian.  

You can't do everything in one year, but I believe that this would give us the best chance to improve all the areas hurting.

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1. Sign a free agent OL

Who? What Free Agent LT was available? This isn’t magic, there has to be someone there. Faneca was the only real name at OL and He’s a guard. Don’t get me wrong, I’d L-L-LOVE to see Faneca standing next to Chris Williams, but the Jets were throwing money around like silly and the bears just don’t do that. And honestly, they’re smart not to. History has shown that throwing extravagant spending DOES NOT yield results.

2. Sign Michael Turner.

Actually, this I completely agree with. I don’t think he should have changed the draft AT ALL, however I just thought, going in, that Benson+Turner would be an awesome 1-2 punch, and now I think Turner+Forte would be even better, but Oh well.

3.Sign Berrian.

Sure, it sounds good to say that, but the Vikings made him an ABSURD offer. For what Berrian has shown the NFL the past 2 seasons, Jerry Angelo would have been STUPID to match that offer. Godspeed Bernard, but I look forward to watching Peanut pushing you around twice a year.(He would’ve been dumb to franchise him as well, since the franchise tag is the average of the top 5 contracts at that position. And since WR is a glamour position, he would’ve been making money usually reserved for talents the likes of Randy Moss and Chad Johnson and he simply. didn’t. deserve. it.)

4.Ruben Brown.

Played like shit last year. He’s over the hill and I’m glad he’s gone.

5. Ricky.
well, duh he needs to be traded. He plain sucked last year.

6. Benson. He couldn’t have been traded for anything worth getting. We had a better chance of rebuilding the line for him to run behind and hoping to get value for our pick via production, instead of the 6th round pick he could’ve got in a draft day trade. Obviously he went and got arrested and now it appears he’s more or less blacklisted.

—-—-
The ONE thing Jerry Angelo didn’t do that I am still irate over is not signing Bryant Johnson from the Cardinals.
a 6’3”, 215 lb, former 1st Rd(2003) pick WR with deep threat speed, who has virtually NO wear’n’tear (not to mention an unknown ceiling for talent) due to playing behind the best Wide Receiver tandem in the NFL?
and there wasn’t even a bidding war, he was one of the LAST free agents signed. Honestly I have no idea what excuse they have for not grabbing him.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 1, 2008 5:13 PM CDT   0 recs

All this is hindsight of course, but

Berrian – To win and give your offense a better chance, one year of the franchise tag is not completely stupid. The point was not that he was worth it (he isn’t unless you talk to the Vikings), but it would give us 2 seasons to replace him instead of one. A couple million extra is worth it if you are trying to win a Superbowl which they say they are.

Benson – a 4th or 5th rounder would have been worth it since we got nothing. We got a 3rd for Chris Harris. Benson was worth something, but not a lot. That pick could have been very valuable, maybe a QB.

Had we picked up Turner and traded Benson, we could have still picked Forte. If we kept Benson, we would have used the Forte pick on a QB which we screwed up on this year. We are another year behind on developing a new QB. I would love to say Hanie or Hill can do it, but let’s be realistic..

You can’t tell me there was no options available better then Terrance Metcalf. I’m not saying the best guy in the world, although that would have been nice, but Beekman is behind Metcalf that hasn’t done anything ever on this team and he’s been around. I understand that last year he had a cast, but that wasn’t his only season.

We agree on RM, Jr.

I’m just saying if you look over the plan, I think it was pretty strong. Many disagree about over paying Berrian for a year, but sometimes you take the hit because you want to win. It is one season not 5. If he rises to the occasion you still have the guy. We had so many draft needs this year 2 OL, QB, RB, DT, WR and all to be starters, you needed to fill some holes before the draft. Locking up your #1 receiver to bye some time would have been helpful. All of the things I mention, the Bears could have pulled off. Signing Turner would have been the biggest challenge. I’m still in shock the Briggs is still here.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 1, 2008 11:31 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

berrian isnt enough of an impact player on our team

can you name one game in the last two years that he has won for us, that if he werent on our team we would have lost, I can say that about several other bears, namely briggs urlacher harris hester, and that is why we are paying them what they deserve. Yes it would be nice to have berrian this season as insurance but the price is why too high, I’m not saying we couldnt afford it, but just because you can afford something doesnt mean you should buy it.

"snuffalufagus fucks my shit up"

by leopoldjones on Jul 3, 2008 1:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That's fair that you just don't think he's worth it even if you can afford it.

He did win us at least one game last year, when he made an amazing diving catch in the back of the end zone. For all his drops last season that was one amazing catch! I want to say it was the Broncos, but I don’t remember what team really.

The market has inflated. A guy like him is worth 6 mil minimum and a lot of people don’t realize that but it is true. When the DT from Oakland gets a record contract for no apparent reason it shows the market has gone way up and players are getting big pay checks.

If you want to win this year guys, Berrian could have helped that happen. Our offense could be worse than last season. I do have optimism, but it is just that. Hope really. I think our D will be awesome and I’m exicited. A guy like Berrian could mean the difference between scoring 13 points a game and 20 points a game (by moving the chains, not necessarily a TD). 20 points a game could mean the difference between 5 wins and 10 wins. When Orton was our #1 as a rookie I told my friends every game, this D is so good that 16 points is an automatic win and it was right almost ever single game. We hit 16 and it was over.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 3, 2008 2:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

...

Sure the market goes up a bit every year, but one thing.

All it proves when Oakland’s DT and Berrian and Thomas Jones get HUGE contracts is that some teams spend their oney like morons.

Look at some of the last teams to win Super Bowls. Giants, Colts, Steelers, Patriots.
None of those are teams that are spend-happy or overpay for players. The Colts and Patriots are the best examples and they are also EASILY the most successful teams in the NFL over the past half decade.

The Pats CONSTANTLY let go of players who demand BIG money if they don’t think they deserve that much. They draft well and they want to keep the players the draft, so they make what they consider fair offers to those players.
If those guys want more they let’e walk and give the next guy a chance. Ty Law, Deion Branch, Asante Samuel,...
The list goes on and on but i’ll just stop there.

CONVERSELY, the 49ers went CRAZY in free agency last year, landing several guys that every NFL guru was CERTAIN would help them win RIGHT AWAY. And they still sucked.

The Bears aren’t just being cheap here. When it counts, they’re not cheap.
Tommie Harris just received the biggest payday for any DT in League history. When Urlacher signed he was one of the highest paid in the league.
And we aren’t afraid of free agents. When we signed Moose he was the most productive wideout in the game and he got big money. John Tait’s contract is massive. The other O-lineman we signed out of free agency a few years ago also got damn good money.

They weren’t just being a dick to Berrian. They offered him a decent contract and that’s all he deserved.
Not only am I sure that YES, paying 9 million for one year WOULD hurt us but let me ask you something neither of us has brought up yet.

What if we did tag Berrian, and he played even worse than last year? We already showed that he disappeared in the first half of last year and it broke out back in at least two VERY important games?
So what if he got paid and disappeared, or triedhard but just kept dropping important passes?
That 8 or 9 million is guaranteed money.
There is no reason to pay that much to someone whose only skill is as a pure speed, burner type WR.
Like I said, the SMART NFL teams will let a player walk if he demands more than they’re offering.

And let’s be honest, if we’re looking to replace a Burner WR, I think Devin Hester is MUCH more suited to fill that role. Especially now that he’s had a year to learn the playbook and get some practices under his belt.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 4, 2008 4:10 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

All the stuff at the beginning was off the subject and I agree completely.

I’m only saying make one small exception because you want to win now not in 4 years. A Berrian franchise tag would have only overpaid him by 2 million but would have changed the offense dramatically for the better. I love DH myself, I have him as my username here, but no one can guarantee the guy will put up a 1000 yards this season or be consistently effective at the WR position and as a kick returner. He may become a very average WR and a worse returner which overall hurts the team.

Are you confident in this offense this season and in 3 seasons? Why or why not?

That is all I’m curious about and why I wrote any of this. I like the guys playing and think it is possible, but it is purely Lovey Smith type optimism. I would have spent 2 million extra, kept Berrian, loss, Bennet, and gained a QB for the future. For 2 million, that is an investment. If I told you, you could waste 2 million one season only and draft a potential starting QB for your team that would give you 5-7 good seasons, oh and you would upgrade your offensive talent for the year you blow it. Most people would say yes. It is called risk management or a calculated risk. Yeah, you may lose a little up front, but the rewards are worth it.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 4, 2008 10:35 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

No, seriously.

We did the right thing with Berrian. I’m no salary-capologist or anything but I assure you, paying one receiver upwards of 8 or 9 million for ONE years would have hurt us BAD. On top of that, the franchise tag is a mark of respect and accomplishment. Hence the title. It is for a FRANCHISE player. A BIG contributor that is vital and pivitol to the success of the team as a whole. And Berrian wasn’t that guy (and he won’t be on the Vikes, either, no matter how much money they throw at him). I LOVED Berrian. But he was one-dimensional as it gets. He was a pure deep threat. Thats all.

He wasn't that guy that would Consistently go over the middle for the tough yards, he wouldn't run into traffic.

In fact I can (and have) argued that Berrian was our biggest problem at the beginning of the year. In the Chargers game there was a deep ball where he quit on the route because he was headed into traffic. If he had that touchdown, in all likelihood, we win and set a whole different tone for the season.
Then in the COWBOYS game he had a BIG drop for what would’ve been an easy touchdown, and that would’ve changed the face of that game. (and in the process, again set another tone for the season)
There were a dozen or other so drops, but those two were especially big. Those were plays where he didn’t come through and a Franchise wide receiver would have.

I want to emphasize again, that I am not a Berrian hater. I loved him on this team, but I have to be honest that he did not deserve the money. Be it big money contract or franchise tag tender, he didn’t deserve it, and Minnesota will find that out the hard way.

—-As for Benson, I think you kinda contradicted yourself. You mentioned “all in hindsight” but then talk about how we didn’t get anything. C’mon, neither Jerry Angelo, Lovie smith, nor any of the other Bears administration and coaching staff had ANY way of knowing that he’s get arrested. TWICE. Cedric was part of the reason we made Offensive line priority #1 in the draft. No one wants to waste a #4 overall pick and anyone could see that whatever you thought of Benson, he was running behind arguably the worst line in the league last year, and no one, i mean NO ONE ( not LT or AP or LJ) is going anywhere behind a line that bad (BTW, one should take note that all 3 of those dudes have AMAZING OL’s). So we HAD TO give him the benefit of the doubt.

Why you you trade a top 5 pick for a 5th or 6th rounder while you’re IN THE MIDDLE of revamping your offensive line? As the starter last year, he would have to serve as the measuring stick for our OL performance. If his YPC went up 1.9 YPC, well that revamp went pretty goddamn good then, didn’t it?

At draft time, the value was CLEARLY at leaving him on the team and probably starting.

It sucks, that he ended up getting arrested and booted off, but I guaruntee you that every last GM in the league has a story about something that happened RIGHT AFTER the draft that really screwed them. It sucks, but it happens.

As for our Guard situation, I’m actually RIGHT THERE with you dude, lol.
Every time I read about Terrance f-ing Metcalf I am throwing my arms into the air in confusion, yelling “Josh Beekman, Chester Adams, Kirk Barton!!!! Anyone but Metcalf, C’MON!”

Seriously Lovie, we’ve drafted THREE young guards in the past TWO Years and we are supposedly revamping the line. They May be young, and you may be nervous having two rookies comprising the whole left side, but if you do want to revamp, then shit or get off the pot, dude.

And for the record, I completely disagree with the assertion that we should’ve taken a QB in the Draft.
Actually, at first I REALLY REALLY wanted a QB and got mad at every round that Angelo passed on one, until i saw an interview with JA after the draft.

In the interview he stated that he wanted one too, but every round they were looking at a player who they could foresee starting THIS year. Maybe not in week #1, but that sometime this year everyone they picked in rounds 1-5 could conceivably start if needed to. He mentioned that a guy like Zach Bowman in round 5 was just TOO GOOD too pass on for a Quarterback that wouldn’t be ready for at least 2 to 3 years. (in the beginning of the interview I believe he mentioned that he and his scouts had Matt Ryan as the ONLY qb who they could see being ready to start his first year.)

I have to say, once I saw that- I was convinced. I looked back at it and our draft was masterful. Arguably the best draft in the league.
We covered SO many needs. (OL, RB, WR, DT, and S were ALL bigger needs than QB)

Seriously, If you’re looking at a QB thats gonna need 3 years to be ready, then Orton is exactly what you’d be drafting. The only difference is that Orton has already had those years to learn.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 2, 2008 1:26 AM CDT   0 recs

ummm?

I don’t know why it turned turned the part that starts with “He wasn’t that guy” into code but all I said was that he wouldn’t go over the middle to get the tough yards and wouldn’t run into traffic.

dunno what happened there. sorry.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 2, 2008 1:30 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Good points.

- I think Berrian is worth 6 mil a year and 2 extra to have give your qb’s a fighting chance is worth it. Also, he seemed to play better down the stretch, and make some tough catches, but I agree he was soft early and may still be soft.
-On Benson, I think there was enough foreshadowing from most fans to say, let’s get something for this guy and go a different direction. I agree the line hurt his chances, but his attitude and work ethic were also poor and a drain on the locker room. I had the forsight to trade him, and I think the Bears had to have at least considered it. As good as our draft was a 4th rounder that could have been conditional to be a 3rd would have been even better. That post was written in Jan by the way and I knew to get rid of him then. Others did as well, I’m not the only one. I just wrote the post.
-We messed ourselves over badly by not bringing in quality young guys on this line for the last several years. Beekman is not behind Metcalf because of lack of experience, but because he is most likely worse. That is the sad part.
-I respectfully disagree at QB. I thought the same as you when I heard JA say there was no one they believed would make an impact, but 2-3 years should have started this season since we have Rex for 1 and Kyle for 2. That guy could be ready like Aaron Rodgers now is. I wouldn’t be scared as a GB fan to have him coming in. If you look at who we could of had all the way through the second round, I would have loved to see us package a 4 and 3 to get Henie or Brohm. I also loved our draft by the way, but having a WR and new RB, would have given us more flexibility this year. We had to have an amazing draft this year. Although getting a starter this year is nice, the future is also important and if we had a RB and WR already, we could have done something at QB for the future with either of those picks.
-Orton will get 2 more seasons to become a full time starter or backup. He is still developing and could become a respectable starter or just a solid backup. During that time we could be raising up a guy who may have a higher ceiling. You don’t know that Booty, Henie, Brohm, and the others are not going to be better than Orton, just like I don’t know they’ll be better. If you don’t do anything, you don’t have any options at the end of the Orton deal. Good QB’s never leave there team. The biggest mistake last season was the Atlanta/Texans trade of Matt Shaub and they are eating it now. That rarely happens. You have to draft a guy and we are one more year away from giving anyone a shot.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 2, 2008 9:49 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

had he made

some of those catch at the beginning of the stretch, “down the stretch” may have actually meant something.

by mike b on Jul 2, 2008 9:58 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

For Real.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 2, 2008 9:36 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

what?

Foreshadowing? There are no events, on the planet to foreshadow 2 DUI arrests in 1 months. Sorry, no.
And if you think there is a team that would’ve offered a 3rd round conditional pick, then I say you are FAR too optimistic. A continuously injured, badly producing RB with a horrible attitude that LACKS decent speed would fetch no more than a 6th rounder. (maybe a CONDITIONAL 5th)
The VALUE was in keeping him.

As for packaging a 4 and a 3 to get Henie or Brohm? That means We lose Steltz (and Safety is a BIG need) and Marcus Harrison or Earl Bennet (both player were a steal in that round and DT and WR were again BIG needs.
DT, S, and WR were all bigger needs than QB, especially when you consider those 3 guys will START this year.
Not to mention that Henie and Booty just plains sucked and Brohm will not be ready for at least a couple years. (also Keep in mind that Brohm came from Loisvile, a QB factory and he will likely be the next Joey Harrinton.

I want a QB as much as everyone else but you. are. reaching.
There were no good quarterbaks available.

We would’ve had to give up GOOD draft picks that we could use this year for BAd ones we can’t.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 2, 2008 8:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Look at the whole package, not one thing you don't like. The key is overpaying Berrian.

You’re not seeing that people like myself wanted to get rid of him. BTW the team wasn’t very fond of him, he lacked effort, courage, commitment, among other things. The real reason we didn’t trade him was because we didn’t know how healthy he was and knew that would lower his value. A 5 or 6 pick is better than none. I just through numbers out of what to shop for. It may have happened, it may not have.

If we had Turner, we could of used the second round pick on a QB of our choice, or we could have packaged two picks to get into the bottom of the second round. Had we franchised Berrian (and overpaid, I know, let’s agree that would be overpaying), we wouldn’t need a receiver this season. We still would have had Olsen, Clark, Berrian, Hester, Bradley, Davis, and Monk. Not bad.

You are breaking down the arguments individually and it was more of a whole package thing. It was a way to fill every need including getting started on the future at QB. Obviously, some moves were going to be more realistic then others like cutting Fred Miller.

Rex, Kyle, Brohm
Berrian, Olsen, Clark, Hester, Bradley, Davis, Monk
Michael Turner/Benson
Williams/FA Guard

We still could have had. All of our mid round picks that you mentioned.

Rex, Kyle, Brohm
Berrian, Olsen, Clark, Hester, Bradley, Davis, Monk
Michael Turner/Forte
Williams/FA Guard

We lose Bennett. We trade the 3rd and a future 2nd. Next season we pick up a 4, 5, or 6 for Benson depending on the trade.

This very well could have happened and should have. How would the salaries have worked out, who knows. We would have probably been right at the limit, but our offense would have been much more impressive then it currently sits.

Our offense is the reason people doubt us not the defense. If we don’t win this year it will be because our offense is horrible.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 2, 2008 9:51 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

of course i'm arguing individually

because we didn’t GET Turner, Berrian was TOO expensive, and so was Faneca.

You’ve said a couple times that we’d be at the limit for salary cap.
You DO REALIZE that is a very very very bad thing, right?

If we threw 9 million at Berrain, then threw a bunch of money at a FA guard and Michael Turner, do you think re-signing Tommie and Hester would even be an option?

And to look Further down the line, by the time next year’s draft came around we would be forced to unload players. (and not by trade, we’d most likely have to drop them outright to make cap space just to sign our draft picks.)

This big scheme of yours is a pipe dream, and not a very good one.

Bernard Berrian would NOT have put us over the top (cause he never did) and Michael Turner is comletely unproven as a feature back.

You don’t build teams via free agency or by throwing ridiculous amounts of money to players who don’t deserve it.
In all likelihood Earl Bennett (the post productive receiver in SEC history) will be a better overall WR and have a better career than Berrian.

You build teams through your own draft. And that is exactly what Angelo is doing.
If there was a Quarterback that our scouts believed could turn into a good, productive QB, I’m sure they’d have drafted him, but every draftnik was unanimous that after Matt Ryan, everyone was a BIG gamble.

If we take Brohm and he becomes the second coming of Joey Harrington, then the joke that is Chicago QB’s just continues.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 3, 2008 1:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

You're points are not even on the subject man.

-Berrian – 1 year only then off the books. That doesn’t hurt us.
-I never said Faneca, I said FA Guard and we both agree we needed that one
-Turner – Would have been a big signing and would cost us on our budget
-You don’t unload players when the cap goes up each year, look at the last two seasons
-We probably still could of signed everyone, we are well below the cap. I bet we’re still 10-12 million under after signing Harris and money could have been deferred one year to afford to keep Bernard.
-Berrian wasn’t meant to put us over the top, just make us better. Where do you come up with these points.
-We still would be building through the draft, we just had too many holes this season. How good do you feel about our offense? You shouldn’t be real confident. They may surprise us, but 2 FA signings and keeping Berrian for 1 season, would have been worth it.
-Your remarks about drafting a QB make no sense at all. Start a fanpost about only that subject and you will get murdered. I don’t have a problem with Rex or Kyle because I think they are both still moving up in their skills, but you plan today or you are burned tomorrow. That is why our line is so terrible, but I guess you want the same situation at QB.

Disagree all you want, but the plan was to implement the whole thing. If we land a FA G, not Faneca it wasn’t worth it, but someone else more reasonable, not even a star, then kept Berrian, traded Cedric to anyone for draft picks (yeah I said gain a draft pick because the draft is important), try to get Turner, still draft Forte, and try to pick up a developmental QB. Our defense would have still gotten Harrison and Steltz for depth so quit arguing that. We could have traded the Bennet pick and next year’s 3rd to get into the late second and grab someone at QB. The only thing you would have lost would be Bennet, but we could work on WR and OL next season. As it stands we have to work on OL, depth at RB, QB, WR probably, and they all need to be starters. Good luck with that. That is assuming all the guys this year did well.

Could someone else jump in and give an opinion. I’m pretty sure someone else thinks we should have landed someone at G in FA, and tried to grab a QB in draft this year instead of next. That means next year is a bust if our two headed QB ? marks don’t pan.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 3, 2008 12:22 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I covered Berrian for the last time in the post with ”...” as the subject but I’ll just say that YES, one year of WR Franchise money WOULD hurt us. It would all affect the money for NEXT year’s draft

We don’t even need to argue about Turner, I wanted him.

I’ll say this about a FA G. If it wasn’t Faneca, then we didn’t need to bother.
Seriously, a lot of the performance of guards (at least in pass protection, which was our real weak point) is all based on the perfromance of the Center and Tackles.
If you have a Center and Tackles that play REALLY well, then as a rule, the guards will perfrom well too.
Most guards that play like crap are playing next to crappy tackles. Because if a Tackle goes too far out or back then that gives the Guard a HUGE area to be theoretically responsible for, and simply not many guys can handle it.

I think Chris Williams was a great GREAT pick. I was hoping they’d get him specifically WEEKS before the draft.
I think he’ll learn very quickly and I think Tait will play much better on the right side. As such I think that spending money on anything less than a First Class talent at guard would be a waste of money.
Faneca would make that line a bunch of badasses, but a lesser free agent would’ve only been a slight upgrade for much much more money.

I’ll be brief about QB. We planned for “tomorrow” several years ago in picking Orton. He was our developmental guy and i think it’s time we see how much he’s developed.
I think we still need MORE developmental guys and (again) I wanted a QB too!!!
But when it came down to it, this year’s QB class was GOD AWFUL, and there’s no sense in picking a crappy college QB to develop into a worse pro.
Henie had an amazing team around him, including an absolute Beast at LT and very productive RB’s and WR’s, yet he always looked like shit. Booty was handed the reigns to a terrifying USC squad and never showed anything more than mediocrity. Brohm is the product of a QB factory and will be a terrible pro.
If the draft class wasn’t so bad I’d agree with you, but to pick those guys would be throwing away draft picks that we ended up using on guys that will make this team better. (and they’d make it better much sooner than any of those QB’s would have)

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 4, 2008 4:30 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

So let me get this straight.

You recommend:
- signing Alan Feneca or nothing to improve the G position
- not signing Berrian to improve the offense for one year
- not trading Benson for any kind of compensations when we had the opportunity (as low as it may have been, just keep him)
- waiting yet another year at QB no matter what your options were available to you to pick up a Brohm or Hennie
- drafting Bennet instead of investing one of the QB’s above to start the process of developing a new QB. (by the way if Grossman sucks again we don’t have a backup QB next year and if Orton sucks too we’ll be forced to start him because no one was in training)

Really the main problem I think I personally have with your philosophy is that you are not willing to use the resources available to you to improve your team. You are basically draft or bust. Your fine with putting a crappy offense on the field. I suggest a 2 million dollar solution to dramatically improve our offense now and possibly the future and you scoff. That’s fine. I own a business so I guess I just look at it in a business mindset. You invest, you take risks, you improve everything you can, and you are never complacent.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 4, 2008 10:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

no one was realistically talking about trading benson

yes he sucked last season, but that was as much the lines fault as it was his and when the line played better down the stretch benson played better, at least prior to his injury.
And he said that none of the qbs were good enough to even invest in, you shouldnt just bring in a guy for the sake of bringing in a guy if the bears brass didnt think brohm, hennie or booty was the guy than why draft them especially at the expense of losing a guy (bennet) who they think is a starter. Personally I would have liked them to grab brohm, but I am pretty happy with what ended up happening, and there is always chris simms.

"snuffalufagus fucks my shit up"

by leopoldjones on Jul 4, 2008 3:28 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Thank You.

I LOVE the Bennett pick. I can’t believe he dropped to round 3 but since he did I think he’s a big sleeper for this year.

C’mon he went to VANDY and in only 3 years became the best receiver in SEC history. Aside from one year of catching passes from Cutler, he didn’t have big name QB’s, yet he produced big numbers while playing against top tier SEC defenses. That says something.

I certainly don’t want to give that of for a crappy QB. I mean YES SURE we need a developmental QB but if they all suck our hands are kinda tied.

BTW, I have a good friend who is a Packers fan (yeah, i know, even I”M surprised Bears and Packers fans can be friends) and he was telling me there’s reports that Brohm is struggling more than Flynn, the 7th rounder.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 4, 2008 11:11 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I like Bennet and the draft we did as well.

I’m being attacked here like I hate our GM or team or think the defensive picks were not valuable or whatever. I’ve say none of this. I loved the draft personally. My critique is more of a couple moves they didn’t make before the draft like trade Benson or sign a FA guard or franchise Berrian. I just don’t think they put themselves in position to have a solid offense this season or even next season. They knew they weren’t going to be able to challenge Benson in the draft and draft 2 starters on the line a qb for the future and WR help. They did well, but they left to many pieces for the draft and it cost them drafting a guy like Hennie, I think they would have liked to of had.

I think the Bears thought they could get Hennie or Brohm and would have taken either and screwed up and didn’t get them. After that they hated the QB’s left and decided not to draft them. The Bears never said they didn’t like any of the QB’s only what was left. I think the Bears would have liked to have gotten one of two I mentioned.

People did want to get rid of Benson on this site. Maybe not you, but people were sick of the Benson train JA and Lovie were willing to ride into the sunset.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 5, 2008 10:45 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yknow...

If gone into great detail to build supporting arguments but you have yet to make any effort to refute my points.
like what if we pay Berrian 9 Mil and he plays like he did 1st half of last season… or worse.
What guard should we have taken that would’ve been worth the money. (We needed TACKLES more than we needed guards and there were none up for FA, so we drafted).

And I still can’t believe that you’d trade Benson AT ANY COST.
I couldn’t stand Benson. I’m not defending the guy at all. But I certainly don’t want to trade a guy we can’t get anything for.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 5, 2008 11:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Guard is not a position I could evaluate.

I don’t watch every guard in the league and evaluate them, so outside of the Bears, I don’t know very many OL. I know the line on the Colts and Patriots because they get talked about all the time.

I couldn’t say who would be good to grab, but it is hard for me to believe there wasn’t a player out there with more experience and talent then Metcalf. That guy is barely a roster spot from what I’ve seen of him play. The reason I would want to bring some one in is because we had two holes to fill and filling one with a proven player (maybe just average, but still proven), would have helped to upgrade the line last year. Anyone who saw last season and was fine using Metcalf and a rookie to replace to vets who majorly struggled knows we needed to upgrade not just go with Metcalf. I understand that money would be involved, but my big arguement on this issue is upgrade don’t settle for Metcalf. Williams was part of the answer and Metcalf was not the other part. Do something, anything to help the other position.

I think Benson and all 3 qb’s would have done much better last season with a OL. This year it is imperative because Rex has his last chance. No line, means another season with no answer for how good he is. He’ll be gone and someone else will reap the benefits. I think he can play, but let’s not argue that here.

Benson’s demise was forseeable, but he was the 4th pick and we had to give him more opportunities. I understand why they kept him, but he was a bad teammate, rookie hold out, had two season ending injuries, poor work ethic and lack of desire. Forseeable. He looked better before the injury granted and that was probably the only reason why some team might trade for him. If we had done what I suggested we would have gotten something for him. I’m just saying I was right to get rid of him looking back now. Had we done my thing, we would have some compensation. Monk was a seventh rounder. So was Mark Anderson. We would have gotten more than a 7. I think a 4th possibly conditional 3rd if he had a 1000 yard year or something. We got a 3 for Chris Harris. Think about that.

Honestly, I was starting to look forward to seeing him this year once he got to OTA’s and looked lighter. But in the end, he was an idiot and focused on him self and didn’t value his career and many noticed that since he got here.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 6, 2008 1:28 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you are twisting my words.

-I think Faneca would be the only noticeable improvement. For anyone else, we’d be getting just a tiny bit more skill for a whole lot more money.

-“improve the offense for one year” is NOT the reason for not signing Berrian. The reason is that Footbal is a BUSINESS and the successful teams have good business practices.

-there was NO reason to trade Benson for a Late 2nd day pick. In theory he should’ve run MUCH MUCH better behind an improved Offensive Line.

-YES wait another year because why would you draft a quarterback who everyone knows SUCKS.

-YES draft the best receiver in SEC history of three fututre FAILED QB’s

And, no. I’m not draft or bust I never said that. In fact I said I wanted the Bears to sign Michael Turner and Faneca.

I also said above that the BEST offseason move they could’ve made was to sign Bryant Johnson from the Cardinals. He was an unrestricted free Agent that people weren’t fighting over. However he was a 1st round pick in 03, has GREAT size AND breakaway speed, and a ton of potential that no one has seen because he played behind Boldin and Fitzy.
Bryant Johnson would’ve been LIGHT YEARS better than Berrian.

You think your formula is perfect but i think signing Bryant Johnson along we the draft we GOT would’ve made a TON of difference for this offense.
If the money was there then sure get Faneca and Turner too.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 4, 2008 11:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If you thought

this year’s QB class was “horrible”, wait till next year, when we find out that Orton is a piece of shit and Grossman can’t get it done.

The bottom line is that, since we didn’t draft a QB this year, there’s little chance we draft one next year (unless we get a hight draft pick) when we’re really gonna need a QB of the future.

I am like your Dan Aykroyd and biglow would be Jane, the ignorant slut. -Chad

by thecoolest on Jul 4, 2008 3:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

???

Angelo made it very clear that he WANTED a QB this year, but due to the weakness of the class the closest he came was in the 5th round. He didn’t make that choice because Zachary Bowman was on the board and he had 1st Round talent before he was injured. He’s played well in camp already. He’s big, physical, and has top tier speed even for the NFL.
If he can stay healthy he would be a DOMINANT nickel corner and even be able to sub in for Tillman and Vasher when they’re tired.

You’d really trade that for what? Booty? Josh Johnson? Really?

And since Angelo has said that he wanted a QB, why the hell would we not take one next year? Especially if it isn’t a bad draft class for the position.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 4, 2008 11:28 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I actually

loved the Bowman pick. It ALMOST made up for the picking of Williams in the first.

What I’m saying is, we should have taken a QB this year. I was personally rooting for Kevin O’Connell, but really any QB would have made me happy (except for Booty).

Finally,

And since Angelo has said that he wanted a QB, why the hell would we not take one next year? Especially if it isn’t a bad draft class for the position.

Next year’s draft QB class is going to be MUCH worse than this year’s, even if Tebow and Painter are going to be in it.

I am like your Dan Aykroyd and biglow would be Jane, the ignorant slut. -Chad

by thecoolest on Jul 5, 2008 7:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

too early.

It is way too early to judge the next draft class. At this time last year, people were predicting Brohm to be a top 5 pick.

Also, you didn’t like Williams at #1? I was ecstatic. WEEKS before the draft I was hoping for Williams.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 5, 2008 11:06 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Exactly

and, I HATED the Williams pick. I was rooting for my boy Shard, but I knew it would never happen. After I came to my senses, I decided it would be ok if we took an o-lineman, as long as it wasn’t Williams, the so called “finesse tackle”. But, once again, JA disappointed me.

I am like your Dan Aykroyd and biglow would be Jane, the ignorant slut. -Chad

by thecoolest on Jul 6, 2008 11:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you know...

I think his “finesse” thing is taken a little out of context. I mean his scouting report said that he’s a finesse blocker and weak in run blocking, but I saw an interview with Vandy’s head coach and he was baffled as to how anyone thought he was weak against the run.
He told the interview that anyone who watches Vanderbilt game tapes could see that they always always ran the goal line formation behind Chris, and the scouting report is simply incorrect.

Not to mention, as many times as our Qb’s got HIT (not just sacked, I mean LIT UP) a little Finesse would be a welcome adition.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 6, 2008 11:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

oh...

and how do you know there will be a smaller Quantity of quality guys? My point was that you never know how the year will pan out, and who will step up or falter.

My point about Brohm was that this sure fire 1st rounder had a year that exposed a lit of chinks in his armor; that he simply wasn’t as good as preeicted. People thought Henne would be first round and even Booty was projected in there by some. NO ONE last year predicted Booty would be a second day pick.
And no one was picking Flacco for the 1st round.

If you’re insinuating that because the BIG schools are all using new QB’s, that there won’t be any quality guys, that is ludicrous. There a bajillion schools out there.

I can’t guaruntee there will be top talent QB’s waiting but to be so sure NOW is simply wrong.

Desperation is NOT going to help our QB situation, people.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 6, 2008 11:26 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Or Hindsight or foresight.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 7, 2008 11:52 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

This.

this coming from the guy who thinks we should’ve traded Benson based on arrests that hadn’t yet happened.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 7, 2008 12:54 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Are you saying I didn't have foresight?

Isn’t that the definition of the word. I saw to get rid of the guy because of his past before he imploded. Come on man! Everything is dated and recorded, I what you could possibly be arguing. Benson was not a good teammate and it showed in the locker room and on the field. He didn’t take his job seriously and now he is without a team and I said we should get rid of him before he completely ruined his career. Foresight.

Here is the definition in Websters:
1: an act or the power of foreseeing : prescience
2: provident care : prudence
3: an act of looking forward; also : a view forward

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 7, 2008 2:53 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you and a lot of other people
I said we should get rid of him before he completely ruined his career. Foresight.

like, most of chicago.

by mike b on Jul 7, 2008 3:12 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Finally!

I’ve been waiting for someone to say that. Yeah, lots of people thought the same thing. I’m not claiming to be the only one with that opinion, but for someone reason I’m being made to sound like a looney for wanting him gone back in January.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 7, 2008 4:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

a lot of people thought it

but that doesn’t guarantee it was a good point. at no point was cedric benson going to bring anything in a trade, except MAYBE after 06, but even then it was minimal. coming off a bad year and a bad injury i don’t think a team even trades a 7th for him. you’re other option is adrian peterson behind a bad line anyway, so i don’t think you gain much cutting him after the draft or before you sign your draftees.

by mike b on Jul 7, 2008 5:52 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Isn't something better than nothing?

We should have seen the end and got something. Also we got a 3rd round pick for Chris Harris and gave up a 3rd for Darwin Walker. Someone would have given more than a 7, that is way too low. I think he was in the 3-6 range. With a guy coming off an injury, a conditional pick makes the most sense for both teams involved.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 7, 2008 6:55 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he showed nothing

he’s free now and noone’s taking him.

by mike b on Jul 7, 2008 9:42 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Because they are waiting to see what his suspension will be.

He’ll land a team once they know what the consequences are and what kind of risk he will be their team.

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 8, 2008 10:02 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I do...

I do agree that they’re waiting for the fallout to clear before they go in…

but i’m also curious to see if his career might just be over. I think either way, he’s looking at an 8 game suspension. And sure a team would pick him up next year. But I wonder what will be left of him.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 8, 2008 1:03 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Goddell

That man IS NOT fucking around. (also keep in mind resisting arrest.)

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 8, 2008 11:01 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Me too. Once OTA's started, I really wanted to see him run this year.

He may have been terrible, but I just wanted to know if he got any better in the offseason or if a better line would have improved his confidence. The good news is for us, he’s gone and I don’t have to worry about him anymore. The Forte era has begun and hopefully he can surpass Benson, Enis, Salaam, and A-Train’s poor careers (A-Train is debateable).

Kick it to me... I'm open!

by #23 on Jul 8, 2008 3:18 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

bad comparsions

Chris Harris was a dependable player with very few if any black marks on his record.

Darwin Walker had 6 sacks the year before we got him IIRC.

Benson was already labeled as 1) a flop 2) a horrible teammate 3) lazy and apathetic 4) slow and lacking ability to make defenders miss 5) greedy and self-serving.
he was labeled ALL of these things by the time you wanted him traded.
You go on and on about how much he sucked then insist we could’ve “got something” for him.
And keep in mind, that most 6th and 7th rounders never make the team. So, more or less, we would’ve been getting “nothing” for him.

1 more time. We’re revamping the O-line. The team (wisely) wanted to wait and see how he ran behind a BETTER LINE.

by HesterSteals1st on Jul 7, 2008 11:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I didn't say he sucked.

I just wanted to move on. How are your guys saying that looking at what we got for him now, that it was stupid to trade him.

Ok, yeah. I’ll take no Benson and no picks over, no Benson and a 3-7 pick.

That makes no sense. I know you don’t want me to be right, but your math is horrible. I saw this coming