What do Rex Grossman, Kyle Orton, and Jay Cutler all have in common?
by diehardbearfan on Nov 14, 2009 4:06 AM CST
24 comments
The answer is that they have all had Ron Turner as their Offensive Coordinator while playing for the Bears. Jay Cutler was putting up pro bowl numbers in Denver before he came to Chicago and now all of a sudden he is throwing up five picks in a game just like Grossman and Orton did while Ron Turner was their OC. I don't think that there is any coincidence. Kyle Orton, although not necessarily convincingly, is producing great numbers in Denver, while a pro bowl quarterback is producing numbers just like Grossman and Orton did during their stays in Chicago. I would also be willing to bet that if Grossman gets a chance in Houston, he will end up producing good numbers as well.
Unlike most of the sportscasters out there, I personally am not blaming the WR's or offensive line for Cutler's problems (although they aren't necessarily helping him either), I am saying that Ron Turner is to blame. In the entire time that Ron Turner has been the offensive coordinator of the Chicago Bears, the Bears offense has been mediocre at best and I am including the 2006 superbowl year as well as his first stint as Offensive Coordinator. If it weren't for defense and Devin Hester, the 2006 team wouldn't have been alowed anywhere near the stadium the superbowl was played in, much less the game itself.
Sorry, I got sidetracked for a minute, but what I am saying is that most of us including myself at one point or another has said, "Well if we just had a good QB then we would be alright". Well we now have a young pro bowl QB and it is not alright, so when you put 2 and 2 together, you find the common denominator.........Ron Turner. I found a site while trying to find ammunition for this rant that is called fireronturner.net and I think it's great, however, I am wondering if WCG or another die hard bear fan with more time than myself can put a petition together to send to the McCaskey's to fire Ron Turner. I heard that the Kansas City Chief fans put together a petition so that Larry Johnson wouldn't break Priest Holmes' franchise record so why can't us Bears fans put together a petition to fire Ron Turner. I am not saying that the petition is the reason that Kansas City let LJ go, however, it is pretty ironic don't you think.
I don't know who the Bears should hire to replace him, but I personally wouldn't mind having Mike Martz come in. Obvioulsy he appears to be an asshole and is a horrible head coach, but nobody can deny his ability to turn bad offenses into powerhouses. Nobody can deny the fact that he can take mediocre QB's and WR's and make them into statistical beasts. Look at Marc Bulger, Jon Kitna, Mike Furrey, Shaun McDonald, Josh Morgan, and Kurt Warner (although Kurt has mainted elite QB status, but was an unknown until Martz), and Torry Holt (who was drafted the year Martz was OC, then had five out of seven pro bowl years under Martz), etc.
Imagine what he could do with a pro bowl caliber QB instead of an unknown or career backup, a WR that could be the best slot receiver in the league instead of a number one receiver, a great running back that can catch (just like Marshall Faulk), and a WR that was the SEC's all time leading WR that is about to enter his third year next year.
What I am saying is that the Bears have a lot of pieces in place on offense they just need the right OC to utilize their talents, and it is up to us Bears fans to have our voices heard. We should all pull together to get Ron Turner fired because no matter who he has at QB, WR, RB, or TE he just doesn't get the job done, and if he had a real job he would have been fired a long time ago for lack of productivity.
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Rex Grossman's
stat line in 2006 is virtually identical to Eli Manning’s in 2007 the year the Giants won the Super Bowl.
Virtually identical except that Eli had eight more completions (and Eli had 5 more fumbles than Rex). Eli recently signed one of the biggest contracts in NFL history. Grossman recently had to beg for a job.
In 2006 Grossman had 20 Interceptions. Half of those came in three games (Minnesota, Arizona and New England). Grossman also had three interceptions in the two playoff games and in the Super Bowl combined.
If you throw out Grossman’s three bad games you have 10 interceptions in 13 games. Add in the three for the playoff games and you have 13 interceptions in 16 games. Less than 1 a game.
That’s pretty good. Right now Cutler has 17 in 9 games.
(To be fair to Jay, if you throw out his three worst games – 12 INT’s against GB, Cincy and SF, you are also left with less than 1 per game).
Not saying that Grossman is a good as Cutler. At all. Just pointing out a few things.
Beyond that, in 2006 Grossman had 23 TD passes. In 2008, Jay Cutler, playing for offensive guru Mike Shanahan and having a great young WR like Brandon Marshall, threw for 25 TD’s.
That’s right. Despite Cutler throwing for almost 4,500 yards (as opposed to Groassman’s 3,200 yards) Cutler only threw for 2 more TD’s than did Grossman (and only had 2 less INT’s than did Grossman – 18 for Jay and 20 for Rex).
Grossman was the offensive player off the month in September of 2006 when he helped lead the Bears to a 5-0 start.
He had three really bad games in 2006.
His stat line was virtually identical to Eli’s and Eli was being called a franchise QB and one of the best young ones in the game (Eli also had Plaxico Burress, Grossman didn’t. Eli hasn’t been so hot without Plax).
And people couldn’t wait to run Grossman out of town.
The difference between the Bears of 2006 and today is this: When Grossman sucked in 2006, the defense and special teams picked them up.
No clearer example exists of this than the famous Cardinal game. Grossman turned the ball over 6 times and played one of the worst games ever in NFL history by a QB.
The defense scored 2 TDs and Devin Hester score 1 TD in that game to snatch victory from the jaws of defeat.
This season, defensive and special teams scores have been non-existent. Beyond that, the defense has been pretty terrible overall.
You're right, '06 Grossman wasn't that bad.
The problem, however, is that he regressed.
And Eli Manning is the most overrated QB in the NFL.
Really? Really?
Ok I’ll bite. Which QB is “The Rapist”.
That’s not true!!! WHY THE F*CK WOULD YOU SAY THAT YOU AHOLE!! Ok maybe your right but you gotta give a little something here for it to work. I don’t know what I’m going to do this is the worst thing I’ve ever read, this day could not get any worse. Fine, F*ck it, you’re right.
by Ditkavsworld
My come back to that would be...when did he regress ?
Rex lost his starting job 3 games after playing in a Superbowl. Lovie bowed to the pressure the of media and fans that created the narrative that Rex sucked. We then went to Brian Griese, and then Kyle Orton.
Rex fans’ biggest gripe was not that Rex was the greatest QB ever, but was that he got a raw deal. The guy who is vindicated the most after watching Cutler struggle and lose fumbles because of our Center isn’t Kyle Orton like his fans would have you believe, it was Rex.
Kyle got a fair shot and is driving a Cadillac offense out in Denver. Jay got what he wanted for better or worse and is the starting QB here in Chicago. Meanwhile, the only guy out of the 3 to play in a Superbowl had to beg for a job. Diehardbearfan is right. Eli and Grossman’s numbers were very similar at the time Rex lost his job. Maybe it isn’t just Ron Turner who is the problem, maybe it’s also Karma for meathead Bear fans that didn’t give Rex a chance to develop and thought it would be more fun to boo the guy at scrimmage games. Now we’re watching a former pro Bowl QB have a worse year than Rex ever had.
When did he regress?
His numbers over the past 3 years.
QB rating Comp % Y/A
’06 73.9 54.6 6.7
’07 66.4 54.2 6.3
’08 59.7 51.6 4.1
Those stats aren't giving the whole picture
How many games did he play in that time after ’06
Bit of advice
You might want to break this up with some paragraphs. More people would actually read it.
Thanks for the constructive criticism.
As you can see I took your advice and fixed it McRipepr. I hope people read it and decided that enough is enough with this clown. I actually did some research and other than Turner, the Bears always hire unknowns to be the Offensive Coordinator. Now don’t get me wrong, I do think that QB coaches and whatnot deserve chances to move up in the coaching ranks, however, that just never seems to work for the Bears. Instead of hiring guys like Matt “Backup quarterback” Cavanaugh, Gary “Razzle Dazzle” Crowton, John “Wide receiver screen” Schoop, and Terry " I deserve more money than what I am worth" Shea. All of these clowns were QB coaches somewhere and had no Offensive Coordinator experience. The Bears need to hire a proven coach for the job. I don’t care what kind of talent you have, if they aren’t properly coached or put in a system that suites their strengths your offense will not be successful.
"I have no comments at this time.....well, other than what I just posted."
by diehardbearfan on Nov 14, 2009 1:00 PM CST up reply actions
You are definitely on the right track.
But I think petitioning really isn’t going to get you what you want. I mean, if it is true what happened in KC it is a little more understandable just because the organization was so on the fence w/ what to do with Larry Johnson for all his antics, and I’m sure the petition just opened there eyes the fans agreed. Now firing a coach is not as much up to petition, you know what I mean? I agree they should let him go, but unfortunately if the Front Office can’t see the common denominator, its just not going to happen.
Back to the status of the current team. They could use another play-maker at receiver, a bigger receiver who can stretch the field or make the catch in traffic. It seems like all the Bears can catch a fly if they are open, great at catching an out-route, but just not a single "Ok Jay lets get the ball to ‘whomever’ on this drive!’ I usually say Olsen, but its sad I want them to go to the TE on every play. But he will go up and get it, and he will catch the ball and take the hit, so its justified, I guess.
Great post.
As frustrated as I am with Cutler, I don’t think it’s a coincidence that he suddenly starts averaging nearly two picks per game under Turner.
Thanks
I appreciate the comment. I worked on it for a long time.
"I have no comments at this time.....well, other than what I just posted."
So...
does anyone have an idea for OC? I haven’t really been able to come up with many names. We needs someone who is good with QB’s and also has a good O-line scheme they can implement.
Hold on now
While I have never been a supporter of Turner, I believe our problems go much deeper than the OC. If you want a QB to play up to his potential, then the support must be there. that would better everything…coaching, receivers, the offensive line, etc. This is a Angelo issue in my book. He’s done a crappy job of evaluating, drafting, and developing talent. Rather than “fixating” on the QB at the end of 2008, he should have opened his eyes and fixed the problem areas on the team. Football is a great team sport and no QB can do it by himself.
right rocko
Cutler previously played for Mike Shanahan who is part of the Bill Walsh coaching tree and considered to be an offensive guru.
In Cutler’s two full seasons under Shanahan they were 15-17.
This with one of the better O-lines and with guys like Marshall, Royal and Scheffler catching the ball.
Agreed.
While I think Turner is partially to blame, and I would like to see him get fired, I still think the O-line is the bigger issue.
I don’t consider Cutler a franchise guy, but for him to live up to his potential, we need better pass protection.
by GouldisGold on Nov 14, 2009 11:25 PM CST up reply actions
my only concern
with the martz suggestion is that he is extremely pass happy and doesn’t like using TE’s that much. after his stint in St. Louis, he hasn’t been even closely successful. the closest success could be the lions 7-9 season. Heck, his time in San Fran was kinda pitiful imo.
i would like to give lovie another year but with a new oc
i have thought for while that turner just isnt a good for the bears. i dont know about martz though hes playcalling beat the hell out of bulger. i dont really know whos out there but chicago has some pieces in place but they need a guy to call decent plays.
and i do blame the line for most of the offensive issues and recievers only faults really are how young and expierence they are. Check This: before this year the only bears with recievers with significant nfl expierence were hester and rashied both came in as corners into the league. I dont think we need to trade a draft for a reciever but i think we do need a big target and it doesnt have to be a big name like owens or they could give aromashadu a shot
turner is horrible
no creativity at all, doesn’t get Cutler out of the pocket which is non-existent, no deep routes for 2 of the fastest wrs in the NFL and a QB with a huge arm
he’s dispicable
When Cutler has time to throw,
we are able to run some deep patterns. Problem is, there typically ain’t time for Cutler to even set his feet, much less have a route develop downfield.
You are all gentlemen (and ladies) and good judges of cheap whiskey.
Grossout. Manning.
Rex sucked, stats are irrelevant. Eli Manning signed a $97 Million contract ? So. And. What ? Eli sucks too and is withot question the most over-rated tool in the NFL.
by Irish Bears Fan on Nov 16, 2009 3:11 AM CST reply actions
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