The Bears 3 Biggest Ripoffs (and what should happen)--2009 Edition
by Kev H on Dec 10, 2009 1:00 PM CST
in Notes
61 comments
Inspired by this article earlier tonight (The NFL's Biggest Rip-Offs), I started to think about what the Bears biggest ripoffs were, when comparing salary to effectiveness.
To be fair, I'm not going to include players like Urlacher, or Tinoisamoa, because they're injured, and I don't think they can be truly judged as ripoffs. But there are a few players who just aren't living up to what we're paying them, and they should be called out.
Then to stimulate some discussion, what I think should happen. Let's delve in below...
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I'm getting votes for Other, but I'm not seeing any comments
on who or why? I’m interested, people, get to it!
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
I'm going with Pace because...
He refuses to play RT, and considering he has very little worth on the left side now it makes him a complete pain in the ass.
Orlando Pace Hands Down............
If this guy wants to continue his career he needs to take his patented pancake block to the inside and play Guard. I hope Lovie gets therapy for his fixation of former St. Louis players. Pace, Archulta and Timo.
I'll third that
Got mocked by Rams fans at work when we picked up “turnstyle” St.Clair. He turned out okay in stretches, but at the end of the day we’ve been nothing but burned by ex-Rams
where's wale?
he gets some nice scratch for basically being invisible against o-linemen who qualify as average or above average. he’s done. gilbert or adams could give us at least what wale does (nothing), while gaining some experience.
He's 3.5
His 6 kinda garbagey sacks bought him off the list. Plus, he’s slated to go FA next year, so there’s not as much of a decision that has to be made, in that, we dont’ have to either waste the salary and roster spot, or eat the salary and move on.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
fair enough
though i think harris has, in some ways, been better than wale. he has actually played well at times against good competition. wale has not. both have been huge disappointments, though, and given that wale’s out of here, he’s clearly less of a headache moving forward.
by guy incognito on Dec 10, 2009 2:20 PM CST up reply actions
Omiyale has obviously been less than stellar this season but...
His contract actually isn’t really detrimental to the Bears going forward. As Kev said, his contract is very front-loaded, so going forward, his cap impact isn’t big at all. And yeah, we definitely paid way too much this season, but we probably weren’t gonna be spending any money on anybody else this season anyways.
What about Cutler?
2 #1s, a 3rd, Kyle Orton and not to mention the extension!! That doesn’t get a consideration? I love JC but lets face it, for what the Bears gave up and this being a 2009 Biggest Ripoff, how does Cutler not get a nomination? Because the Bears got hosed on that deal!!!
I was going to say Cutler too.
Two First Rounders, Kyle Orton for 20+ interceptions and 3rd place in your division? That’s a hefty price. Taking a 9-7 team with essentially the same pieces in place to what looks like a 5-11 finish. Ouch!
I have a feeling my Broncos will never ever get a phone call from the Bears organization again.
Cutler does have talent though…you all need to hire a really good QB coach and teach Cutler some values on leadership.
Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.
The guy formerly known as ZAPPA
I was teasing about the 5-11 comment by the way.
if I were to be honest, a 7-9 finish would look about right for the Bears this year.
Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.
The guy formerly known as ZAPPA
about cutler and leadership
if anything, this season shows how good he is on all this stuff. his o-line gives him no time in the pocket and little room for his RBs, he has no running game to lean on at all, his WRs seem to be very poorly coached as they almost never come back to the ball or run the right routes, and his OC is incredibly predictable and consistently calls a bad game. that’s a lot of crap to deal with, yet cutler has taken the high road all year long. he defends his receivers, his coaches, his line, his RBs…he takes all the shots from the media…he should have exploded by now. as far as i’m concerned, cutler has proven just how good a leader and how mature a player he is this year.
by guy incognito on Dec 10, 2009 2:18 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'd put him on the list as well
but I have issues with your “leadership” comment though. Everything that I’ve heard has been in stark contrast to most fans’ impressions of Jay. He’s done all the right things all year long, and I haven’t heard much complaining about his teammates or the proverbial “throwing them under the bus” cliche everyone associates him with. FO has the Bears O-line ranked in the bottom quarter of the league, and it’s pretty obvious he doesn’t really have a go-to-guy at WR. Furthermore, the Bears running game is second to last in the league in yards per game, in which Forte is ranked a paltry 38th in the league. His poor play is the culmination of several other glaring deficiencies with this team; not exactly a great position to succeed if you’re any QB. I wonder how well Orton would’ve done with this garbage of an offense.
We're not scaremongering (nightmare of a season continues), this is really happening (Bears are more than done) - Radiohead
Main reason why not?
Because Orton would have looked a million times worse, and not only would have thrown interceptions, but would have set back the development of our WR.
Orton is a MUCH better fit for Denver than he is here, his lofty moon shot long balls without a ton of accuracy are fine with a tall receiver that likes fighting for jump balls, not with speed receiverst hat rely more on finesse game.
Ok
But the Bears would have kept those 2 #1s, the 3rd, and the money saved from Cutler’s extension!! This is about biggest ripoff!!
What the Bears paid for Cutler, and the productivity they are getting from him=Epic Ripoff!!!!
And you really think we would have drafted someone better...
Honestly, Knox is probably better than the last two first round picks we made.
What's that got to do with it?
Again, this is about biggest ripoff!!! Not what the Bears would have used their picks on, etc. Throw the picks out the window!! If Cutler was a free agent, and the Bears made him the highest paid QB in the league, based on what Cutler has done this year 2009, he’s not a ripoff?
Because unless you're getting into a discussion of opportunity cost...
Then losing picks isn’t a ripoff if we were going to blow them on garbage anyway. Cutler is better than any two of our last like 10 first round picks.
Cutler was paid to be a QB, not a tackling dummy for the opposing defense.
Pace was apparently paid to be a turnstile, along with Omiyale, and Kreutz.
Right Now
J C is the most expensive Rip off to are team,but in the long run it is Orlando Pace.If Lovie puts Pace in LT then it is hurting 2 things.The progress of Chris Williams and all around are O line.Pace can’t run block or pass block anybody under 6’1.
I know “our” and “are” sound the same, but really…..
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." - Bertrand Russell
"F*** everybody outside of Halas Hall. BEARDOWN" - WavyGravy
Well, to me it's "ow-er" to "arrrrrr" but...
The Bears need to put up a sign if Pace comes back in.
“You must be this tall to play against Pace.”
Not so sure about this
I largely think that regaining the head of the Defense, our trash-talking middle linebacker, will help Tommie’s game.
I think it works the other way around, as Urlacher has zero effect on Harris’ game at the point of the attack. The other down linemen would certainly effect his performance for obvious reason though.
We're not scaremongering (nightmare of a season continues), this is really happening (Bears are more than done) - Radiohead
you are right propheteer
the defensive tackles keep the o linemen off the linebackers, or are supposed to anyway if they are doing their job
"I am not an animal!" - Merrick
I think it goes both ways.
The defensive tackles keep o lineman off the linebackers, unless the linebackers are dropping 15 yards into coverage, like the middle linebacker does.
Something I’ve noticed is that the lack of talent we’re currently experiencing in 2 of the 3 linebacker slots seems to cause the secondary to have to cheat a little extra, to keep the play in front of them.
While there’s no question that improved play by the defensive line means worlds to the other two phases of defense, I don’t think it’s a one way street.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
Are you refering
to Tommie Harris getting coverage sacks, due to Urlacher covering the middle of the field better?
Yeah, sorta
I mean, if there’s not a wide open slot receiver standing in the middle of the field in front of the safeties and behind the linebacker, or guys nailing the slant route ALL DAY LONG with no repercussions, generally speaking, the offensive line will probably break down, either forcing the QB out of the pocket, or causing him to freeze up and get sacked, Jonathan Quinn style.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
It is definitely hard,
for Tommie to look good doing his job, when our CB’s line up 10-12 yards off the line of scrimmage on 3rd and 5 and give up the slant all day. That we can certainly agree on.
i picked pace
I was for the Pace deal too because I was hoping he still had some all-pro gas in the tank and I realized that Cutler would need some protection if he was going to do well here. In hindsight, I think Williams should have been allowed to develop, sink or swim at LT.
A hard question but a good discussion because you can make a case against any of the players named in the poll.
"I am not an animal!" - Merrick
I said Other
And I am thinking Vasher. He signed his contract extension when, after 2006? Since then he’s appeared in 23 out of a possible 43 games and started only 10. Since 2006 he’s only had 3 INTs and 11 pass deflections. He is a huge ripoff.
I voted for Tommie Harris but for the sake of argument...
what about Devin Hester? He has shown flashes of being a quality receiver but has also looked lost. What’s his cap numbers look like? They’re not Bernard Berrian ugly I know, but….
If you can't laugh at yourself you must not be very funny.
It's pretty ugly
But I don’t feel ripped-off by him, because he’s playing at a distinct disadvantage, and he’s showing improvement throughout the season.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
Yeah,
I’m picking Pace too. It was a hard decision I almost picked other. Also, in all fairness I should disclose that I supported Pace’s signing when it happened. Have to say that, because you know Smudgers will go look :)
Omiyale doesn’t play well at left guard, we all know that. I agree with you though that he is young and could still develop.
I think that Kevin Shaffer should get an honorable mention here. It’s not even so much that I don’t like him, but I really don’t like the situation that transpired to bring him here. We pretty much swapped back-up tackles with the Browns. St. Claire isn’t the best tackle, but I don’t see where Shaffer is any better and we already knew what we had in St. Claire. He had experience in our system and backed up every position on the line except for center. I did see Shaffer interviewed on Comcast the other night, you have to give it to the guy, he definitely looks and talks the part of an O-lineman. Let’s hope he starts to look the part on the field too.
Greg Olsen, not saying he is a bad player, so nobody jump on me for that. At 49 catches for 449 yds so far on the season he’s not doing bad for an average TE. I was expecting more though, more YAC, more improvement blocking, and less dropped balls. Greg Olsen was a first round draft pick and I was really expecting Tony Gonzalez, 69 catches for 738 yds, type performance from him.
Since I keep seeing Olsen mentioned...
He’s doing everything quite well, considering he is a TE that is getting double covered. It’s hard to ask more from a TE under those circumstances.
I'll give you
the double coverages. He still falls down to easy for a guy his size, and I’ve seen no noticeable improvement in his consistency as a blocker. I don’t know of a site that tracks drops for TE’s, he has had more than his fair share though. Plus for a guy with his height and speed, It would be really nice to see him fight harder to get the ball or occasionally lay out for one when it is there.
Like I said above, I don’t dislike Olsen. For a first round draft pick though with his size and potential, I was expecting more. I don’t see him really doing anything that Kellen Davis or even Des couldn’t do. And both Des and Kellen block better than Olsen.
LOL!
I just think people should be held accountable for what they say, tis’ all. And I supported the Pace signing too. What can you do?
-------
"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on Dec 12, 2009 7:12 PM CST up reply actions
Cutler
If we’re talking strictly about 2009, then it’s hands-down Cutler. We traded a king’s ransom, pay him elite QB $, and he has not played well. Perhaps he’ll work out for us in the future, but for 2009 he’s been the biggest ripoff in the entire NFL.
Pace – Yes, we paid him a lot of $ to play average at best. But did you really expect much better?
Omiyale – Also disappointing. Though, we asked him to learn a new position on the fly. Never been a starter before. I think if you have him change positions, then you have to consider him a project.
Harris – resigned in 2008, right? He was perhaps the biggest ripoff in the NFL for 2008. As long as he stays on our team, he will continue to a ripoff/disappointment. If his leg isn’t healed by now, then it never will be.
Marinelli “our D-Line saviour” – it just goes to show that talent (or lack thereof) generally trumps coaching.
Olsen – went from upcoming stud to being perhaps the 3rd best TE in the NFC NORTH.
I can't consider Cutler to be the biggest rip-off
because of the terrible conditions he’s playing in.
We have to face facts as Bears fans—Jerry Angelo finally went out and did THE EXACT THING WE ASKED HIM TO DO—get a big play quarterback.
The problem is—we don’t have a big play anything else. Jay’s thrown for the 14th most yards in the league, 2814, and will likely end up with 3500-3700 yards, and that’s conservative passing. That’s with, as we’ve said many times, no protection, and no one 100% trustworthy to catch it. He’s more or less at his career completion percentage, and you can talk about the picks if you want, but they are not all his fault.
I’m simply not going to judge his performance the way I’ll judge that of an offensive lineman, because the roles are so drastically different. Signing a 34 year old LT with nothing left in the tank, who refuses to go to RT where he might be able to extend his career a bit, is more of a ripoff than a guy who’s got all the right stuff to be good, except for the people to block and catch for him.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
Cutler--Not a rip-off
As a previous post indicated Cutler is a big-play QB with no big time players around for support….You can’t just bring a guy in and say—“we are putting this (so—so) football team on your shoulders—-get us to the Super Bowl !!” Hate to bring this up but look at Brett Favre—-He KNEW he had big-time players around him and he KNEW they could get to the Super Bowl…and I hope he does it !!! Da Bears need to look for some “prime-time” wide-outs to go with the running back and Cutler would be a monster !!!
Nobody is saying
Cutler sucks ass!!! The question is who is the Bears biggest ripoff of 2009. Jay Cutler!!! How can you possibly argue that what the Bears gave up for JC and what they are actually getting is a bargain?
Lay it all out please
1. Cutler was not two 1sts and a 3rd. Cutler AND Knox were two 1sts and a 3rd. Both spend a good amount of time on the field.
2. Only one player JA drafted in the 1st (Tommie Harris) has made a Pro Bowl. Now everyone wants him traded.
3. Paying Cutler is paying for potential not immediate dividends. QBs are expensive. Pro Bowl players are expensive (ie Pace).
4. No one is saying Cutler is a bargain. We paid a lot, and it’s too early to tell whether it was too much.
Cutler has proven in Denver that he can throw for a lot of yards (4500+) and lot of TDs (25). To put this in perspective, only 2 QBs threw for more yds (Warner, by only 58 and Brees) and Cutler was 2 TD passes away from tying Payton Manning’s 2008 TD total. Pace basically hadn’t played for the last 2 years before coming to Chicago. Omiyale was a career bench warmer. Harris has been plagued by injury. Going forward, I would consider Cutler the best buy out of all of them.
????
C’mon man, this really isn’t that hard!! The topic is biggest ripoff of 2009. Nowhere did I say that Cutler won’t be great in 2010, 2011, 2012, or 2013. The Bears in 2009 gave up a 1st, 3rd, and Kyle Orton. Not to mention, a humongous extension. Now, will the Bears get the better end of the deal next year or beyond, probably!!! But for right now, Jay Cutler and his 2009 season, for what the Bears gave up and signed him to, is a ripoff!!!
I didn’t say anything about Tommie Harris!!
QBs are expensive? Yes, I know. That’s why he’s been a ripoff this year.
But’s it’s not too early to tell. The topic, again, is 2009 Biggest Ripoff!! How’s it too early to tell who the 2009 Ripoff is? If you can vote for Pace, Harris, or Omiyale, how can you not vote for Cutler?
I don’t see how what he did for Denver is relevant at all. That has nothing to do with 2009!! Is this Cutler’s fault? No, it’s not!! He was traded to a team that has no idea how to maximize his potential. He was traded to a team with a terrible offensive line, ZERO running game, below average WRs and clueless coaches. He was dealt a shitty hand and couldn’t fold.
I love Cutler. I think he’s the most physically gifted QB this team has ever had and I look forward to watching him on the Bears for the next 5 years. But that doesn’t change the fact that he has been a ripoff this year. This isn’t about potential, it’s about 2009, this year. It’s not Cutler’s fault, but he is the Chicago Bears 2009 Biggest Ripoff, hands down!!
The Front Office
The front office continually lets us down. We trade away our second round pick for Gaines Adams. WTF. Our 14th overall selection 2 years ago is just now seeing the field. Most teams draft someone that will make an impact right away in the first round, but the Bears don’t. It all started with the draft of Cedric “DUI” Benson. We had a really good back in Thomas Jones. We decide to draft a RB with our 5th overall pick. WTF. That just makes you have to move Thomas Jones in the next 2 years. So we drafted a position that we didn’t need to fill with our first pick. I don’t know what our front office is thinking. Jerry Angelo has to go!!!!
I said no front office!
But I feel the same, bro.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
i picked pace
out of this list as i was thinking when they signed him that he would work out like ruben brown; 2 years or so of very good play (stereotypical stopgap solution). unfortunately it’s been more like stan thomas out there.
Pace was definately a bust
But hey, is anyone surprised after he got cut by the Rams? And am I the only one who never heard of Omiyale before Angelo decided to throw $15 million at him? Both moves were pretty desparate by Angelo.
As far as Cutler not making the list, of course he’s been pretty dissapointing this year. But I’m sure if he was still in Denver, he’d be putting up better numbers this year. His supporting offensive cast here sucks, in comparison.
"Yes, risk taking is inherently failure-prone. Otherwise, it would be called sure-thing-taking." - Jim McMahon
How the hell is Orlando Pace leading his vote by a landslide?
Are you guys not watching the same football I’m watching.
Pace has been fine. In fact, he’s been an upgrade from last year’s LT John St. Clair. Why is he being the brunt of criticism here? Honestly, the guy’s done an adequate job for his age.
Omiyale has been a friggin waste, and why isn’t Jay Cutler on the list? For everything we expected him to be… he’s not.
Cutler’s proven to be more of a loser than a winner. There have been a handful of games where Cutler’s had the ball in the final 2 minutes with a chance to win the game, and he’s lost it. I don’t care what kind of crappy team you have surrounding you… put Peyton Manning in the same situation, with the same crappy team, and he finds a way to win more than he loses. Put Aron Rodgers in the same scenario, and he’s going to win more than he loses.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Because Orlando Pace hasn't been an upgrade over St.Clair. At all.
Seriously, I never remember St.Clair literally falling over for an offsides call.
I also don’t remember St. Clair getting beat by every single speed rusher in the league. The only thing he has left is his ability to handle power rushers, but there isn’t a whole lot of that coming on the left side.
Omiyale could be right there with Pace, but at least Omiyale is willing to try other positions he might not be terrible at, whereas Pace wants to play LT or nothing and we’d be better off with nothing.
by Jacob Hayes on Dec 10, 2009 11:31 PM CST up reply actions
I wouldn't say he's been a big ripoff
but definitely a disappointment. Sure, he has held his own at times, and even had a few good games. But, has he justified the contract we gave him? His cap hits:
2009: $5.33 million ($1.35mil salary + $3.4 mil roster bonus + $333k of signing bonus allocation + 250k workout bonus)
2010: $4.33 million ($3.75mil salary+ 250k workout bonus + 333k signing bonus allocation)
2011: $5.33 million ($4.75mil salary + 250k workout bonus + 333k signing bonus allocation)
Here are Pace’s grade outs from PFF (new window).
And the damnable thing is, as big of a disappointment as he has been, he’s not likely going to retire any time soon.
You are all gentlemen (and ladies) and good judges of cheap whiskey.
What?
The problem with the Bears is just not with Pace on that O-Line ummm Kreutz has looked bad as well. Moving Williams to LT was a good move and maybe moving Pace to Guard would help. But O-Line is a big problem.
JA has been ripping the club off for years.The Bears have no one on there team from the 2005 draft class. I’m not mad at the Bears for going to get a Jay Cutler but you don’t have the type of O-Line he had at Denver. Everyone is talking about we need Wideouts? Look is Devin a #1 not right now, but with the right Coach say a Jerry Rice who said he would LOVE TO COACH THE BEAR WR’S. Come on!!!!
Wale is not playing like it’s a contract year. Alex Brown has been the best D-Line. Tommie is playing better. The LB’s have not been playing well either. I would move Peanut to FS and Try to get a free agent CB and Draft one.
But JA has got to go!!!!
And another thing
What about Cedric Benson? He’s a cap hit for this season and he’s kicking tail for ANOTHER TEAM! How can he NOT be the biggest ripoff this year? We’re paying him good money to perform at a high level for another team.
If you can't laugh at yourself you must not be very funny.
by Just Dave on Dec 10, 2009 10:34 PM CST reply actions 3 recs
Thank You Just Dave!
And to think he was never convicted of Public Intoxication charges. It seems the Bears found him guilty of the charges before a Court could do the same. Jerry Angelo just cuts him and gets nothing for him. Thank you Jerry you incompetent troll. Pack your things Jerry Angelo.
I did not pick him
Because I consider him to be a ripoff from a couple years ago. His performance, technically speaking, isn’t a detriment to the success of our team (with the exception of the yards he put up against us), because he’s not in a position for us in 2009 where we’re hanging our hat on his success.
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule. -Randal Graves
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