Loud vs. Lovie
by Mark Saade on Dec 16, 2009 7:00 PM CST
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‘We will unleash hell here in December!’ Boisterous post game statement made by Pittsburgh Steelers head coach Mike Tomlin this season after his team had lost three straight games. Apparently the Devil is not a Steelers fan as Tomlin’s team would lose two more games in a row after his fiery comment.
‘On days like today, there’s not a whole lot to say. They definitely dominated us.’ Tranquil post game comment made this year by Chicago Bears head coach Lovie Smith after his team had lost four straight games.
No matter what comments are made or how emotions are shown, the difference between winning and losing depends on the product on the field. Both Tomlin and Smith have had success in the NFL, even though both approach coaching in a very different manner. So which way is the right way? Is there such a thing as a right way and a wrong way to express emotions? Who are we to judge a man’s nature anyway?
When a team is winning, all negatives are forgotten and neither coach nor players can do any wrong. When a team is losing; well...coach and players can go to where Mike Tomlin wished to unleash this holiday season. The Bears are currently rounding out a losing season in which fans and media alike are questioning Coach Smith’s zeal.
Is he too passive? Is he too soft? Show some damn emotion, Lovie!
Yet, when the Bears were winning games and made a Super Bowl run in ’06, Smith was praised for his calm demeanor.
He has a fatherly way with the players, he shows them respect and that seems to work well with today’s athletes.
Being from Chicago and a fan of the Bears, we are always going to remember the great Mike Ditka. The man who flipped the bird at NFL Films cameras and yelled at his Punky QB right on the sidelines for all to see. Ditka’s personality is in your face, no holds barred; tell it like it is whenever and wherever. Obviously his personality would come across in his coaching. This was fine, it worked. The Bears have never been better.
It was a change of pace when Lovie Smith was hired to coach the Bears. Lovie is to Iron Mike what Yin is to Yang. In the City of Broad Shoulders this took some getting used to. But only three years into his coaching regime, Smith took our Bears to a place only Ditka had taken us once before, the Super Bowl.
Though Smith would not match Da Coach's accomplishment and win the big game; he lost to his mentor, the also soft spoken Tony Dungy.
In a sport as intense as football; it is perceived that a coach of powerful, intimidating, gladiator like men must be loud and overbearing. Though this can work, it is not the only way. Patience, understanding and calm has been proven to lead to victory as well. Through Smith's tenure, Bears players have always come to the defense of their mild mannered coach. Never once has a player called out Smith or made harsh comments to the media about their coach’s make up. If these men of violence and courage do not question their leader’s temperament, should anyone outside of that locker room have the right to?
Don’t get me wrong, Lovie Smith’s defensive schemes, player evaluation and game plan are all suspect. A football coach at the highest level should be able to match wits with his peers on a weekly basis. Maybe Smith is no longer the man for the job in Chicago, but that should have nothing to do with his personality. He was not hired for his disposition; he shouldn’t be fired for it either.
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Hester talked about "changes" in an article.... He just Tweeted this about an hour ago...
I feel like the media blew my interview out of proportion and that everything I said was reworded or taken the wrong way.
When I am asked, "Will there be changes?" my answer is "yes". What I mean is; there will always be new guys (rookies, trades or coaches)
That goes for every team, whether you are picked up or traded, it is still a change to the team.
After reading current articles I feel like the press tried to make me seem like I had inside information on the future of coaches or players.
Which is not the case at all.
I believe this is one of the articles he was talking about… Hester: Many changes ahead for Bears by By Jeff Dickerson
ESPNChicago.com
You can find Hester’s twitter page HERE. D_Hest23
GO BEARS!!!!
It's really this article from David Haugh
And… competing for web hits, was this Jay Cutler interview by Dan Pompei:
On communication problems with receivers: “Those guys are doing everything they can. I don’t want to say we are working out issues. It’s just one of those things where some things happened. We had some different protections going. Some of it worked, some of it didn’t work. That’s how it goes. Ultimately, it just boils down to me and not putting those guys in a position like that and throwing the ball away or taking a sack.”
On if he had the same kinds of issues with then-rookie Eddie Royal in Denver last year: “No…. Different player, different system. Every player is different. The way we attacked defenses was a little different.”
On his relationship with Ron Turner: “It’s been good. There is an open line of communication. We’ve both been honest with each other. There has been some give and take on both ends.”
On if he has learned from him: “Yeah.”
On if he would talk with team management about Turner if asked for his opinion: “I’d tell them how I feel, absolutely. But by no means am I going to march up there and tell them what should happen. That’s up to them.”
On what he would say: “At this point I’m not going to start going down that road. That’s not my job.”
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
It's real simple.
A) The goal in the NFL is to win the Super Bowl
B) Go down the list of Super Bowl winners and one will find that most were of the ‘dicator’ type like Lombardi and Ditka and Parcells, among most others (like say Don Shula, Dick Vermeil, Jon Gruden, Tom Coughlin, etc).
They were loud, and in-your-face and intimidating coaches who demanded the best out of their players, whether they wanted to give it or not (and faced with peer pressure and potential embarassment and possible loss of playing time, usually gave it)
B) Then there are more quiet ones (like Tom Landry and Bill Walsh and Joe Gibbs and Bill Belichick) who were/are almost considered football genius types.
C) Guys like Lovie (and Dick Jauron and Dave Wannstedt, for example) belong in neither catagory.
D) For Bear fans, it’s actually pretty simple. Regarding our last four head coaches, we’ve had one ‘prick’ (Dan Hampton’s word for Mike Ditka) and three ‘nice guys’ (Wannstedt, Jauron and Lovie).
I vote for a real prick as head coach the next time around (or a genius type).
That would exlude your basic Wanny, Dick and Lovie types.
Hell even Wanny could win a Super Bowl with Manning, Wayne and Harrison
(Asshole Sr) "If you learn one thing here, NEVER pass out in Ohio."
loud or quiet
A coach’s coaching style becomes ineffective, then it is time to show that coach the door. Simple.
Neither way is good or bad.
"I am not an animal!" - Merrick
It's not about being loud or quiet.
Many make this mistake.
It’s about the ability to lead a group of men. And to lead them extremely well.
Guys like Tom Landry and Chuck Noll never said two words to their teams. And they had ‘looks that could kill.’ One look from those guys was the same as a guy like Ditka screaming his head off.
Anybody that could look at Lovie Smith the past three years and say that he’s an effective leader is delusional.
Two things about Dungy
Yes, you are correct.
However, this guy played for the Pittsburgh Steelers under one of the toughest coaches in NFL history (Chuck Noll).
Dungy may be quiet but he’s no ‘pushover.’ By a longshot.
And he inherited one of the all-time great QB’s in NFL history, Peyton Manning. Also, his former GM, Bill polian, is widely considered to be one of the very best in the NFL at assembling talent.
Rookie HC Jim Caldwell is now 13-0. That speaks volumes.
Dungy mattered in Indy, but so did guys like Polian, Tom Moore and Peyton Manning.
When Mike Tomlin said that his team would will unleash hell in December,
did he intend it to the opposing team or was he actually saying this to his fans? First, you lose to one of your most bitter rivals, the Ravens. Then, you lose to the Browns, another one of your most hated rivals and you even manage to not score a touchdown to arguably the worst team in the NFL. Happy holidays Steelers Fans!
by braziliancubsfan on Dec 16, 2009 9:17 PM CST reply actions
At least they won the Super Bowl last year
I wouldn’t mind going 0-16 if we won the Super Bowl the year before.
Through Smith’s tenure, Bears players have always come to the defense of their mild mannered coach. Never once has a player called out Smith or made harsh comments to the media about their coach’s make up. If these men of violence and courage do not question their leader’s temperament, should anyone outside of that locker room have the right to?
Not to do with whether Smith’s style of leadership is good or bad – I think it can work just as well as a fiery Ditkaesque HC, though he’s clearly lost the team now – but if my chances of getting playing time, thereby raising my profile and value and, ultimately, prolonging my career and earning a big payday depends on keeping my mouth shut except to back up my head coach, chances are that I would. Maybe the big names don’t need to worry so much about that, but one does not publicly criticise one’s boss and expect it to go well for you.
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." - Bertrand Russell
"F*** everybody outside of Halas Hall. BEARDOWN" - WavyGravy
I wouldn't call out or question my boss either
if he made my life easier than say, a Mike Ditka would’ve.
That’s the whole point.
That’s why a guy like Steve McMichael critcized guys like Neill Armstrong and Dick Jauron: Nice guys who were taken advantage of by many of their players.
Look at the Cowboys
Jimmy Johnson was a miserable prick to be around (two Super Bowl victories and the guiding force behind the pllayer personnel on his teams).
Guys like Dave Campo, Chan Gailey and Wade Phillips are all considered to be nice guys (and haven’t won squat).
Mike Ditka + Jimmy Johnson (pricks who helped their teams win it all).
Dave Wannstedt, Dick Jauron and Lovie Smith = Chan Gailey, Dave Campo and Wade Phillps (all nice guys who were much more cut out to be coordinators than head coaches).
Tom Landry wears a lot of rings too
And he was never screaming his lungs out. He had the respect of his team because he was an incredible coach. .
I don’t recall Don Shula being a raging force on the sideline either.
All I’m saying is that you need to earn the respect of the players, no matter what type of personality you have: a hot head or a quiet leader.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Everyone is right
In their own way. But to me the issue with Lovie’s temperament is that he let’s players walk all over him. They don’t criticize him openly but it seems that they’ve quit on him. I mean this is the guy who plays rewards dram queens with playing time at the expense of better team players i.e Tommie Harris and Cedric Benson. I think that a great HC has to have a medium of both calmness and hellfire. And guys like Landry and Shula were good for their era’s. Back in those days players weren’t the whiney babies they are today. Back then guys just wanted to play. Nowadays players want to be coddled and Lovie is that type of guy.
by frenchbears113 on Dec 17, 2009 12:27 AM CST up reply actions
Exactly
That’s what I said earlier.
Landry didn’t scream. He didn’t say two words to his trooops.
But he was a ruthless prick. His players didn’t like him. They feared him.
He was cold to and aloof from his players. He was as far from a ‘nice guy, players coach’ as one could be.
One icy look from Landry was as effective as five minutes of screaming from a guy like a Mike Ditka.
Steve McMichael referred to the guy Mike Ditka replaced (Neill Armstrong) as a nice guy who many players took advantage of. He labelled Dick Jauron the same way.
Nobody in their right minds would ever say the same about a Tom Landry. Or a Don Shula.
That’s the issue here. Not the decibel level of the coach in question.
Lovie’s problem isn’t his decibel level. It’s that he’s too much of a nice guy (ala Neill Armstrong or a Dick Jauron) and not enough of a ‘dictator type’ like a Vince Lombardi, Don Shula, Tom Landry, Mike Ditka, Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, Chuck Noll, Dick Vermeil, Jon Gruden, Bill Cowher, etc, etc, etc.
It’s not about the decibel level. It’s about the ability to lead.
No reasonable person would look at Lovie Smith last three years in Chicago and say that that is the best that the Bears can do as far as a team leader in concerned.
The fact that he will probably be retained because of the money he is still owed tells you all you need to know about the priorities of the McCaskey family.
Who’s the hottest coaching cadidate out there? Mike Shanahan.
He wasn’t, however, too good not to get fired (and to be replaced by a young, first-time head coach) last year.
Josh McDaniels will almost assuredly win more games this season in Denver than Shanahan won in each of the past two with the Broncos.
That’s the difference between a Pat Bowlen and the McCaskeys.
Bowlen desperately wants to win and has the guts to do the best to make that happen.
The McCaskeys? Not so much.
Lovie
I don’t care what he is. I don’t care if he’s quiet or loud!! I don’t care if he’s a nice guy or a prick!! I don’t care!!! What I do care about is good football!! Something the Bears haven’t done since 2006!! I don’t understand why you can’t be both. Why can’t he be quiet and good to his players, but yell and scream when they start a game with 3 false starts?!!!
I hate to keep bringing up Singletary on this site, but I saw him wired for sound one game and what he said to his players was incredible!! One of his players dropped a pass and when he was walking back to the sideline Mike was asking him, and this is from my memory, “did it hit your hands? Did it hit your hands? No, I don’t want to hear about the trajectory and all that, did it hit your hands?” The player says yes and Mike say’s ok then!! He cools off and goes over to the guy who was visibly pissed and told him “Son, you make that catch 100 times in practice!! It’s no different. You can play this game son!! Go out there and play the way you are capable of playing!!” That’s the kind of coach I would play my heart out for. That’s the kind of coach I would love to see coaching the Bears.
Totally agreed!
Lovie just sits there with a blank look on his face staring up at the monitors.
Get in someone’s grill! Yell at JC if he throws a dumb INT like other coaches.
Now days though, coaches are soft and the players rule.
Bring Singletary to Chicago and EVERYONE will be happy. Including this guy.
Hey I love Singletary as much as the next guy
But when exactly did he join the ranks of elite coaches.
At this point, I’ll be happy with Mr Snuffleupagus (yes, I did have to google his name) from Sesame Street coming in as HC if it means Lovie’s out.
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." - Bertrand Russell
"F*** everybody outside of Halas Hall. BEARDOWN" - WavyGravy
Mike...
Would be welcomed with opened arms in CHI.
He is a fair couch who loves the players and isn’t afraid the throw down if someone (Vernon Davis) pulls rank.
Lovie would just turn away and say, “We will work on getting better next week.”
A new HC and OC would make a HUGE difference for our squad, whether it is Singletary or Shanahan. Just SOMEONE else. Please. Chicago and this guy would be HAPPY :)
He's not an elite coach
He’s what’s known as a potential great coach in progress.
All great head coaches (like Lombardi, Parcells, Walsh, Ditka, etc, etc etc) started out this way.
A) They, at one point, were ‘first time head coaches’ (Lombardi in GB, Parcells in NY, Walsh in SF, Ditka in Chi).
B) Almost all started out slow record wise (Walsh was 2-14, Parcells was 3-12 -1, Ditka 3-6, etc).
EVERY great head coach in the NFL got his start somewhere, like Mike Singletary in SF.
And NOBODY would’ve labeled some all-time greats (like Lombardi, Walsh, Noll, Landry etc) as an elite coach after one season.
Right now, Mike Singletary is NOT an elite head coach (how could he be? He inherited a .327 team).
He does, however, have an excellent chance of someday soon becoming one.
That’s the whole point. It’s like a horse race. Anyone can pick the winner AFTER the race is run. That’s easy. The hard part is picking the winner BEFORE the race is run.
Many, many laughed at the Bears and George Halas when he hired Mike Ditka as his new head coach in 1982. Ditka was a hot head (they said). Ditka wasn’t even an NFL coordinator (they said).
Guess who had the last laugh? (Mike Ditka – he was the head coach of the most dominant team in NFL history, the 1985 Bears)
I like this post.
I agree with the fact that it doesn’t matter if he’s soft-spoken or loud and abrasive. All that matters is that he and his players have that respect and drive to win. Many inspirational people were not in-your-face types of people.
I feel that his demeanor has nothing to do with his coaching abilities. I think it’s just a way for people to try to give a reason why they don’t like him or why they don’t think he’s a good coach – not an actual proven characteristic that is necessary to be successful.
"A lot of fans were drawn to me because they knew that whatever the score was, I was going to run as hard as I could on every play. You don't have that now, you have guys waiting for next week or even next year." - Walter Payton
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