The Asst/HC Title in regards to Lateral Moves
This subject gets beaten up in the threads, but it is such a reoccurring topic I thought I'd drop in on the front page. Every time someone mentions a name to replace Ron Turner as offensive coordinator or even a name to replace Pep Hamilton as quarterbacks coach we get the lateral move conundrum.
Bottom line is, a coach that is under contract with another NFL team can not leave his current position unless his new position represents a higher title (* see below... the rule may have been changed, teams have the right to block their assistants from interviewing with other teams). And yes, a team can easily slap the Assistant Head Coach title before his actual title to circumvent the rule, but is that really good business on a prospective coaches part. How often does this happen? Has it ever happened? I'm sure it has, I just can't think of any instance.
Usually franchises use the Asst/HC title for their coaches in order to protect themselves from other teams poaching their staff. Like Jason Garrett the Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Coordinator in Dallas, Russ Grimm the Asst. Head Coach/Running Game Coordinator/Offensive Line Coach in Arizona, or Winston Moss the Assistant Head Coach/Inside Linebackers in Green Bay. They don't want to lose their own guys unless they're going to get a head coaching job.
Other times teams use the Asst/HC title for a long time veteran coach, or a guy that was a previous Head Coach himself, as a way to give him his proper respect. Like Rod Marinelli the Asst. Head Coach/Defensive Line here in Chicago, Marty Mornhinweg the Asst. Head Coach/Offensive Coordinator in Philadelphia, or Mike Tice the Assistant Head Coach/Tight Ends in Jacksonville.
Some teams have more than one Asst/HC on staff. The Houston Texans have Alex Gibbs who is their Assistant Head Coach/Offense and Bill Kolar who is their Assistant Head Coach/Defensive Line. While others have no coach designated as Asst/HC. Technically speaking the Asst/HC is second in command, but how much weight that title carries really depends on the Head Coach and the organization.
Getting back to the point of this post: Could the Bears really steal away a teams offensive coordinator just by adding the Asst/HC title? Yeah, but we all know they won't. For starters, doing this kind of move would be very, very, very, pricey. Odds are an offensive coordinator isn't leaving one job for another (even with that fancy new Asst/HC title). He'll leave one job for another only if a fat raise is attached. Most Assistant Coaches are looking to run their own show someday, so when picking their jobs, doing so with tact is an important thing to keep in mind.
Mike Heimerdinger, the O.C. in Tennessee, is an oft mentioned name here on WCG. Unless he's really really looking to work with Jay Cutler, then why leave the Titans? There's no such thing as job security in the NFL, but coaching in Tennessee is as close as it gets. It's a good and loyal organization that has had the same head coach, Jeff Fisher, since they were still known as the Houston Oilers. Why leave that team for a team that has a GM and head coach on shaky ground, a history of being frugal, an offensive line in flux, a young and inexperienced group of receivers, and a notoriously cheap organization? Did I point out their penny-pinching ways twice?
Cam Cameron is another name brought up by Bears fans. He's currently the O.C. in Baltimore, but again, why leave the Ravens for the Bears? When did Chicago become some kind of dream job that would see coaches leave their current positions? Again, a coach currently employed as an O.C. will only come to the Bears as an O.C. (with that new cool Asst/HC title of course) if they get paid. And I did cover the economical ways of the McCaskey clan.
In my opinion the Bears have 3 options for a new offensive coordinator:
1 - Hire a guy currently not employed by an NFL team.
2 - Hire a position coach away from an NFL team and promote him to O.C.
3 - Keep Ron Turner. I just shivered typing that...
With so many teams rumored to be making changes at the top, the list of candidates should grow. Then again with so many job openings looming, they better act quickly. The Bears need to target a few guys at seasons end (if they haven't started already) and get someone in place. The 2010 offensive cupboard isn't entirely bare, so finding a coach that would relish the opportunity to work with Cutler, Greg Olsen, Matt Forte, and Devin Hester shouldn't be too difficult.
* It looks like there has been a change in rule *
I recently found this…
Back in the day, it used to be you offered a promotion, you got your guy in town for an interview, and he got a deal done. That is no longer the case.
from this:
Changing coaching staffs isn’t as easy for teams as it once was
I was also forwarded the following link…
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Comments
I'd like to see
the Bears go after Mike Leach for OC.
Here’s why:
1. He’s one of the great offensive minds in college football.
2. He’s available.
3. Given the bad pub. he’s had recently, we probably wouldn’t get in a bidding war for him.
4. It would allow the owners to keep Lovie for a year or two while we decide if Leach is HC material.
He’d be coming into a program with a franchise qb, a young roster, and an offense that has vast room for improvement, which would probably be appealing to him.
The only downside, imo, is the negative publicity and somewhat tarnished image he has right now. In a couple months, that will fade, and the Bears would be getting a heck of a coach that they normally wouldn’t be able to get.
DEJESUS!!!
Right on the MONEY Dane...
I was saying the same thing. Either they will go after a position coach, an unemployed HC/Coordinator, go after a college level Coach/Coordinator or keep the current staff.
My thought process with the Cheapness of the owner being well known and with a possible lock-out in 2011, why pay for something in 2010 that won’t be useful in 2011. The logical choice, the cost effective move, would be to keep current staff for 2010. In 2011, if there is a lockout they will be paying the coaches to sit at home anyways so why not just keep the ones you got instead of paying for two sets (Lovie & crew plus the new HC & crew). If there is no lock out, then you can replace the HC/OC or let them ride out their contracts, either way why double the bill when you don’t have too.
That’s not true!!! WHY THE F*CK WOULD YOU SAY THAT YOU AHOLE!! Ok maybe your right but you gotta give a little something here for it to work. I don’t know what I’m going to do this is the worst thing I’ve ever read, this day could not get any worse. Fine, F*ck it, you’re right.
by Ditkavsworld
I'll let Lester know that
you liked it. :)
You are all gentlemen (and ladies) and good judges of cheap whiskey.
Whoops, my mistake
I stand corrected…Nice job Lester.
That’s not true!!! WHY THE F*CK WOULD YOU SAY THAT YOU AHOLE!! Ok maybe your right but you gotta give a little something here for it to work. I don’t know what I’m going to do this is the worst thing I’ve ever read, this day could not get any worse. Fine, F*ck it, you’re right.
by Ditkavsworld
Thank you for putting this up so now everyone can be informed about this rules.
Good job Wilt!!
(Asshole Sr) "If you learn one thing here, NEVER pass out in Ohio."
But it is not as if the rules
really prevent any team from hiring a guy, that is the real point.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jan 1, 2010 11:20 AM CST up reply actions
lol are you out to get me or what
(Asshole Sr) "If you learn one thing here, NEVER pass out in Ohio."
It's a cluster F... they're gonna clean house. That's my opinion.
They need to hire a new OC… and a new DC.
Lovie isn’t gonna coach the D next year. Nor is Babich, who might be gone entirely. And making Rod the DC would be another head scratcher by Lovie, when Rod could’ve been hired as the DC this past offseason.
So… a new OC, and a new DC? Just can everyone and start over. They’re already cutting Lovie’s balls off anyway. Every assistant he’s hired has stunk (Terry Shea, Bob Babich, Rod Marinelli). But, the assistants Angelo hired (Rivera and Turner) have been at least competent and had success.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
I wouldn't mind a house cleaning
I just don’t see Lovie gettiong axed
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Dec 31, 2009 10:49 AM CST up reply actions
repost
As far as Jay calling his own audibles… I wouldnt doubt it one bit if he decided to do it for this game. Think about it, he knew the stage was on Favre and Childress with their whole audible fiasco goin on, and Jay, not knowing him but just telling by his demeanor, and his comments in previous interviews (not really backing Turner), was like, "im takin this into my own hands, what more can we lose, I’ll be here regardless," probably is why we had as much success offensively. I can completely see Turner insisting throughout the season that Jay stick to the game plan and only moderatly check out of called plays. Jay’s expressions, both body an facial tells you all you need to know about the QB and coaches’ relationship and confidence in each other.
As far as the defense goes, well Lovie is the blame here. He took over the D after last season because he felt he could do better and didnt, so he should be held accountable. Due to it being his system, we now have players who are only really fit for his style of play (DBacks who can only play zone coverage, or they struggle in man coverage(exception Bowman) ), which essentially makes it difficult to adjust during games when plan A (the Tampa 2) doesnt work. Once Urlacher got hurt for the year, so did the scheme. Most D’s that use it has a very good to great MLB (Brooks, Urlacher, Fletcher-Baker). Although I do feel he will be back, just forced to change Coord’s, appoint someone to run the D, so he could "focus" more on the atmosphere of the overall team(JA and managements logic), and we will see the same thing we’ve seen for a few years now, just with a little seasoning on it because of the newly appointed Coord aka "Jay’s stregnth caterer". And a new defensive philosophy.
My opinion, dont fire him, you’ve got to pay him anyways. Demote him to Linebackers coach, and Let a new coach come in with his Coords until Lovie’s contract is up. I mean, he is a very good specialty coach/Coord, he just doesnt have the head coaching capability, IMO.
maye
He did audible out of a run for the winning TD.
"Why does Jay Cutler look so bad running these awful plays behind an incompetent offensive line?" - VeryFakeAlDavis
Not exactly true.
An OC can make a lateral move if he willing to default from his current contract and run the risk of being sued. Remember this is america and there is no forced servitude.
In the NFL...
the team that wanted to hire away an O.C. would have to pony up some draft pick or cash compensation
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Dec 31, 2009 10:48 AM CST up reply actions
You should add a part about the compensation
for coaches like shannahan who are getting paid from there old team. That also creates alot of confusion.
We could hire
Jim Zorn when he gets fire from the redskins. I have read that he is a good OC.
He has never been a coordinator
only a QB coach and a Head Coach
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Dec 31, 2009 10:52 AM CST up reply actions
maybe the assistant "to" the head coach title will do?
nice read ,but i think the cupboard is bare.
the 4th option is hire a new head coach, smith is a dinosaur. with a QB like cutler you would want to run a pass first type of offense, and that’s not the kinda coach lovie is.with all of the new rules turning the NFL into a track-meet,he is ill suited to coach in today’s climate
it may be a 4th option...
but I don’t see the Bears going that route
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Dec 31, 2009 11:18 AM CST up reply actions
your probably right.....
but if you look at most of the teams in the NFC playoffs, green bay ,saints, eagles,and now the vikings (brets forcing chilly), they all have a great passing attack.
the ability to win a shootout is a must in the new NFL,now the bears have a QB with the talent, but a coach that ties his hands.
the bears need to draft ,and or sign, a whole new receiving corp.
Excellent read! Black Monday
Will certainly make things interesting/exciting around Bears Fanland… Until then…
IMHO, Lovie stays. Turner, among other offensive coaches go…
Essentially we would need someone that just wants to work as an OC and somewhat desperate for a job (considering the shaky ground that Lovie and Angelo currently stand on). A couple of coaches that I feel fit that mold:
I’m not Anti-Weis. He’s had a solid offense everywhere he’s been.
Al Saunders may be worth bringing in, to see if he’d be interested in returning as an OC.
(He’s currently an offensive consultant for Baltimore)
Neither get me too excited… Come Black Monday, many more choices, there will be…
I guess it depends on how you define a solid offense
Weis’s offenses at ND were not elite, they were pathetically one dimensional and were exposed in too times in the red zone, even this year with Clausen and Tate.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jan 1, 2010 11:22 AM CST up reply actions
They were one dimensional on offense?
323 pass yds per game & 128 rush yds per game.
I don’t watch much ND football, but they’ve seemed to me, to be a good offensive football team under Weis…
One reason an employed OC might be willing to go to Chicago
as the ‘Assistant HC/OC’ would be under the assumption that if/when Lovie is fired he’d be next in line as the new HC.
As far as how often does a coach leave via the Assistant HC route Mike Singletary did just that when he left Baltimore for SF. He was the LB coach under Mike Nolan in both places and that was the only way to make the move.
It happens.
some possibilites here
First, Lovie Smith still supposedly has autonomy over his staff, so he would theoretically be choosing the next Bears HC (ugh.) He can either do what he has in the past, and choose someone who lacks credibility or experience, which might get him fired if the Bears offense doesn’t produce next year. Alternatively, Lovie can hire someone who is a solid bet at OC or AC/OC and risk that person supplanting him as HC if the Bears are better on offense and still bad on defense and we see the same coaching failures of 2009. The latter doesn’t fit Smith’s MO and is unlikely IMO.
Second, assuming the PFW is inaccurate or things have changed at Halas Hall, Angelo could have some input on the OC decision and bring in a promising OC or AC/OC with the intent of promotion to HC after Lovie is fired.
Either way, I think it would be tough to bring in a good OC with the current instability at HC and GM.
"Why does Jay Cutler look so bad running these awful plays behind an incompetent offensive line?" - VeryFakeAlDavis
Mike Heimerdinger himself made a lateral move
from the Jets OC in 2005 to the Broncos Assistant HC/OC in 2006/2007.
Russ Grimm made a lateral move from the Steelers O-Line coach in 2006 to the Cardinals Assistant HC/O-Line in 2007.
Was his contract up in Baltimore?
Nolan was starting his staff from scratch in San Fran when he hired Singletary. It may happen, but not very often.
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Dec 31, 2009 1:00 PM CST up reply actions
His contract wasn't up in Baltimore
Singletary was his LB coach when Nolan was the DC in Baltimore. He wanted Singletary and took him with him to SF by giving him the title ‘Assistant HC/LB’s.’.
I listed two other examples above (Heimerdinger & Grimm).
It happens far more often than you are suggesting
Were their contracts up?
Starting an entire new coaching staff and wanting to pick your 2nd in command is a lot different than what the Bears will be looking to do.
What is the Bears policy on having a second Asst/HC?
And why would any of these current O.C. want to leave their situation to go to the Bears?
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Dec 31, 2009 1:17 PM CST up reply actions
None of their contracts were up
hence, their additional title (Assistant HC).
Not saying this has anything to do with the Bears situation, just pointing out that lateral moves happen.
Ken Whisenhunt wanted Russ Grimm as his O-Line coach. Grimm was under contract with Pittsburgh. Grimm became the ‘Assistant HC/O-Line’ in Arizona.
And like I said, one reason a guy might do it would hypothetically be for more money (not likely with the McCaskey’s) and if he felt he might be next in line in Chicago to replace Lovie as the HC of the Bears.
What about this...
Since Marinelli is already the Assistant HC, give whomever the title of Assistant to the HC. Like in The Office, Dwight is the Assistant to the Regional Manager.
by boondock_saint812 on Dec 31, 2009 2:09 PM CST up reply actions
Get Your Facts Straight
You state: “Why leave that team for a team that has a GM and head coach on shaky ground, a history of being frugal, an offensive line in flux, a young and inexperienced group of receivers, and a notoriously cheap organization? Did I point out their penny-pinching ways twice?”
As reported by Mule Train yesterday on this site, the Bears have the 5th highest player payroll in the NFL. That’s not what I call cheap. Bad decisions on how to spend it, no doubt. But cheap? I don’t think so.
The Bears are historically cheap
Just because Mule Train pointed out that they currently have the 5th highest payroll, that doesn’t really change history.
Historically speaking they have been a penny pinching orginization. Isn’t that a fact?
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Jan 4, 2010 8:45 AM CST up reply actions
There are diamonds in the rough though...
The Bear organization needs to do some research on the whole football scenerio and if and when Turner is axed, look for the best fit as far as an individual that has the track record and consistency with his offensive plays and the imagination of confusing defenses and having confidence in his Qb to audible when necessary.
I like the idea of Grimm more than anyone else...
but I doubt he comes here to be the OC after we didn’t give him the HC gig. Maybe he’d interview for the HC job again if Lovie is fired?
I only brought up Grimm to show
an example of a coach making a lateral move.
He’ll probably get a few interviews as a HC in the near future.
* It looks like there has been a change in rule *
I recently found this…
Back in the day, it used to be you offered a promotion, you got your guy in town for an interview, and he got a deal done. That is no longer the case.
from this:
Changing coaching staffs isn’t as easy for teams as it once was
I was also forwarded the following link…
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Jan 4, 2010 10:21 AM CST reply actions

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