Average Starting Field Position, Bears v Broncos

by BullsFanInSeattle on May 29, 2009 7:42 AM CDT Comment 24 comments

Greetings. I apologize if this is a repeat topic, I searched the archives and did not see anything similar.

In all the various attempts to evaluate the Jay Cutler-Kyle Orton etc. trade, I read much about the respective OLs, WRs, RBs, and TEs of the Chicago Bears and (or versus) the Denver Broncos. But for some reason, there was never much discussion of the special teams. I couldn't help but harken back to that Bears-Broncos game of November 2007, when Devin Hester returned both a punt and a kickoff for a TD, and Charles Tillman's critical punt-block set up a tying score after the Bears were down by 14 late in the game.

Then I found this link on Stampede Blue - an Indianapolis Colts sbnation blog - in which the author calculated the average starting field position - offensive and defensive - for every team in the NFL over the last 5 to 8 years. (The article was written earlier this month.) Towards the bottom you can click through the link to look at the compiled 5 years' worth of data. I expected that the Bears would be among the leaders, but I didn't know where the Broncos would end up. Suffice it to say (or write, in this case), I was completely surprised.

The Bears were # 1 in the NFL, with an average starting field position of their own 33.6 yard-line. The Broncos, on the other hand, were # 31 in the NFL starting at their own 28.6 yard-line. That's a difference of 5 yards - PER DRIVE! Each team gets about 12 drives per game. The Bears' special teams and defense (in the case of punts) - on average - make the field 5 yards shorter for Jay Cutler than the Broncos did. And Kyle Orton's field just got 5 yards longer. (Past performance is not a guarantee of future returns; but Bears' ST Coach Dave Toub and all of the ST skill position players - Hester, Manning, Gould, etc - are still with the team.)

2 recs | Comment 24 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

I always knew we had great starting field position...

We just never had a QB who could take full advantage of it…

OH!… WAIT! WE HAVE A QB NOW!

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on May 29, 2009 9:08 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

yep

but not the return specialist.

by mike b on May 29, 2009 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Danieal Manning would like a word with you.

Be nice. Flag comments that you think are offensive. Use the "reply" button. Drink plenty of water. Compliment others. Rec comments and posts you like. Don't call people names. If you don't like someone's comment, attack the comment and not the commentor. Learn the difference in your/you're, then/than, to/too. Exercise. Relax. Stretch often. Find good in the world.

by Dane Noble on May 29, 2009 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

True about Manning and

hopefully not as many three and out’s this season.

Hear about the blind hooker, you gotta hand it to her.

by Bears fan 4-ever!!! on May 29, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

predictable

when daniel manning shows that he could be the best return man in the history of the game, then you can bring him up.

by mike b on May 29, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Predictable as well.

So your way of thinking is, we have great starting field position (and now the QB as Sack pointed out), and the #1 KR guy in the NFL last year in Manning…

But because he isn’t the greatest in the history of the game, then we don’t have a return specialist?

By that logic, we have no one in any position then. Well, crap. There goes our 2009 season.

by Dane Noble on May 29, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

that field position

was in large part becuase of hester’s reputation and his raw ability, that is why teams bounced kicks or kicked shallow to keep it away from him. as good as a year as he had Daniel Manning should not want to “have a word with anyone,” to keep using terribly worn out blog phrases.

this study was more that 1 year, meaning the number one ranking was not due to daniel manning. So yeah, maybe we have a return guy, but we HAD the best and there will be a drop off. maybe manning is in his 9th position and showing a falsh of potential only to have the league adjust.

don’t try to tell me what i think.

by mike b on May 29, 2009 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I didn't read the link,

but got the impression that the great field position numbers were over a few-season span. Last year, Manning made our FP happen. Last year, Manning was #1 in the NFL in KR.

The previous years were definitely because of Hester, and you can argue until you are blue in the face about how good he was. And I’ll agree with you 100%. I’ll also agree that Manning isn’t close to being what Hester was.

My reply to you was focused on the fact that you seemed to infer that because Hester wasn’t doing KRs anymore, then we don’t have a KR, when in fact we do have one that was the best in the league last year.

And I wasn’t trying to tell you what you think. I was trying to figure out your logic in your 5 word statement.

by Dane Noble on May 29, 2009 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

over a 5 years span

daniel manning is responsible for 36 of the attempts that made the bears squad #1.

do that for a full year and then the bears “have a kick returner.” second and third year numbers mean a lot more than first partial year numbers to me at least.

by mike b on May 29, 2009 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Then we are on the same page.

There are constantly “great” returners who show a flash for a season (maybe 2) and then teams adjust to them, like you said above.

But, Manning did a lot in 13 games… and until he falls off, there is no reason to say that we don’t have a returner.

by Dane Noble on May 29, 2009 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

ahhhh GB...

you’re SO ZEN!!!

Courage is not the absence of fear, but rather the judgement that something else is more important than fear.

by windycity72 on May 29, 2009 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sometimes teams adjust

and sometimes the returner’s own team needs to adjust. Not in Manning’s case, so much, although I do feel that there were several instances where Manning was one block away from much bigger runs, but in Hester’s case. When he returned punts last year, I felt like his side-to-side running style was creating so many blocking penalties, so on the rare occasion that people would actually kick to him, a lot of them would get called back. You need to learn how to adjust your game to best suit your returner, ya know? Maybe it’s just wishful thinking ; )

by ChiTown2ShineIn'09 on May 29, 2009 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

no we're not

i am not overwhelmed by 36 attempts. we had a return man. we have a question mark now. i am not concerned with other people feeling the same way.

by mike b on May 30, 2009 12:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm so confused...

are you saying that the league’s #1 returner is a question mark?

by ChiTown2ShineIn'09 on May 30, 2009 1:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He's saying that 1 year (or 36 attempts)

is not enough to judge a KR by. I am a little more optimistic… Manning showed last year that he can make it happen, and I reckon that until he falls off, I will trust that he is a good returner.

by Dane Noble on May 30, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Amazing

what a good return/defensive game can do for the team.

You're being very Un-Dude right now.

by IslandBoodler87 on May 29, 2009 9:13 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I like our ST unit, but still miss Brendon Ayanbadejo.

- Smudgers

"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox

by smudgers on May 29, 2009 9:31 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I

Agree totally.

You're being very Un-Dude right now.

by IslandBoodler87 on May 29, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Brad Biggs has a nice article quoting Toub on the impact of losing so many STers here. Things were ironed out by mid-Nov (apparently), and Manning reaped the reward.

"They tried to take out the quarterback, and if they managed that, they tried to take out the backup." - Bears SB20 TE Emery Moorehead, on the mentality of *that* defense

by Spongie on May 29, 2009 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

nice read, thanks.

And as much as it pains me, I think we may lose another in Adrian Peterson this year. Another one of my favorite Bear ST contributors.

- Smudgers

"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox

by smudgers on May 29, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, that dude was a Beast!!!

Hear about the blind hooker, you gotta hand it to her.

by Bears fan 4-ever!!! on May 29, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Great Research.

I totally agree that maintaining our special ST play is a key factor in our success going forward. In the discussion of our 53 man roster, there are MANY, MANY decisions that will be made based on players ability to provide quality play on ST.

This is especially true for reserve RB, LBs, TE, WRs, DBs— in essence, the places where many of the most difficult decisions need to be made with rgds to who we keep and who we let go.

by The Kaiser on May 29, 2009 9:35 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

First thing I thought of

was STS when all the analysis was being done on the Cutler trade. Does their #1 ranking take in consideration turnovers created by the defense? Or is it just possessions after a punt/kick?

"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus

"Invincibility lies in the defence; the possibility of victory in the attack." - Sun Tzu

by propheteer on May 29, 2009 10:56 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Good question

In looking back at it, his research does definitely take field position after turnovers into consideration, and not that just after kicks. So the metric also speaks well of the Bears’ ability to generate takeways, and their sometimes-uncanny knack of advancing the football after a takeaway.

by BullsFanInSeattle on May 29, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs