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Why I don't want Bill Cowher next year and you shouldn't either

There's been some talk recently about whether Lovie will be around if the Bears don't make the playoffs next year, and who would replace him.  Some Bears fans are googly eyed over the prospect of (1-time) Super-Bowl winner Bill Cowher coming here.

 

I saw the news about the Rams releasing Pisa Tinoisamoa over at Football Outsiders, and this comment made me think about why having Lovie now is good for the Bears, and bringing in Cowher would be bad:

Somewhere out there is a Tampa-2 team that needs a smaller linebacker. Although -- man, the number of Tampa-2 teams has dropped, hasn't it?

Over the past few years, how many teams have switched to 3-4 defenses?  This year, the Chiefs and Packers are switching.  Dallas has been there for a few years, as has San Diego.  San Francisco switched recently.  The Jets will probably still operate as 3-4 somewhat, of course the Pats and Steelers do, and so on...

Meanwhile, how many Cover-2 teams are there?  I don't think Jim Schwartz runs one, so Detroit is out.  Green Bay is out.  Tampa and Indy are presumably still in, but after that...

My point here is simple.  To run a specific defense, you need players who fit that defense.  Anyone who's spent time studying defenses know that the players you want in a Cover-2 system are much different than what you want in a 3-4.  Cover-2 corners have to be stronger and don't need to be as quick as 3-4 (or any other system's) corners.  The defensive tackles need to be smaller and quicker, able to penetrate the line.  And so on.  But, in general the supply for each system doesn't grow.  So, your ability to get players to fit a system is mostly constrained by the demand--how many other teams also want players for that system.  And it's there that I think the Bears will have an edge in sticking to a Cover-2 in the future.  Because there won't be as many teams looking for the players the Bears want on defense, the Bears A.) won't have to look as hard, and B.) won't have to pay as much in terms of draft picks and/or contracts.  So, having Lovie and the Cover-2 stay on would let the Bears have the pick of the litter for defenders in the future.

Compare that with Bill Cowher.  Now, his coordinators (Dom Capers, Dick LeBeau) were more closely associated with it, but Bill always ran a 3-4 while he was with the Steelers.  I'm certain that if he was our coach next year, he'd want to switch the team over.  But unlike the Steelers, who had built up a strong base of 3-4 players for years and only had to fill in the cracks each year, the Bears would have to basically start from scratch for the entire defense.  I'm not joking; most of the players the Bears have on defense now wouldn't really fit anywhere on a 3-4.  That would leave the Bears begging and clawing for the scraps that were out on the market to make a defense, and it would show.  The Packers basically got extremely lucky that B.J. Raji, who projects to a perfect fit for the critical NT position, fell to them in the draft.  But there are maybe one of those players each year, and you have to fight for them.  There's a good chance that the Bears wouldn't get the guys they need.

I understand that the defense was not up to most people's standards last season, and I agree with that assessment.  And I realize that people want accountability, and I concur.  If Lovie can't get this thing working, then he might need to be let go.  But I think the road will be easier for us in the near future if we can stick with the Cover-2.  At least until it becomes super popular again.

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Good point; the issue of supply/demand and having to re-jig the players we have wasn’t something I’d thought about.

by Spongie on May 9, 2009 10:53 PM CDT reply actions  

in a heartbeat

cowher should have been the bear’s coach years ago.

everything about him screams DA BEARS. he’s like Ditka (both from Pennsylvania btw) part deux.

by tempchad on May 9, 2009 11:02 PM CDT reply actions  

I Hate Cowher more than onion dip

why the hell would we want a coach who another team modeled it’s mascot after?

Think With Your Dipstick Jimmy!

by ifuwannacrownem on May 9, 2009 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

you do realize how irrational that post is, right?

you might now want him for many reasons, but the one you listed is, well, (i’ll be nice) silly.

by tempchad on May 10, 2009 1:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

It might be silly,

But whenever I see Steely McBeam with his stupid towel, and his big ass grin and big ass chin, my heart fills with rage. I hate the Steelers. More than the Vikings, more than the Packers, more than any team in sports. the one true Superbowl they deserved to go to, they were thrashed by the Cowboys.

I hate hearing about the Steel Curtain, and their ‘roided up players, I hate seeing Terry Bradshaw’s mug on the Television every sunday afternoon, always reminding everyone how he won 3 superbowls.

I’m gonna bitch slap the next Steeler fan that tries to compare Franco Harris to Walter Payton(Believe me, they’re out there).

Great Job getting to the superbowl by beating a team with a rookie QB and a defense that played for 17 straight weeks. How does it feel to be GIVEN 2 superbowls by the referees?

Funny how Dan Rooney is our new Ambassador to Ireland. Oh and Obama is really a Steeler fan? whowouldathunkit?

Lastly, Thank you Art Rooney for introducing Ed McCaskey to the Halas family. Did wonders for our team.

Week two can’t come soon enough.

Think With Your Dipstick Jimmy!

by ifuwannacrownem on May 10, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

ode to a...

terrible towl ass-whoopin!!!!

by windycity72 on May 10, 2009 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ifuwanna

It would really help if you explained a bit more why you hate the Steelers MORE than the Packers lol. Equally is one thing, but you hate them more than the Cheeseheads?

by Chitownproduct on May 11, 2009 1:04 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I hate GB...I hate Pittsburgh...I hate Dallas.

I understand where you are coming from because I hate the Steelers as well, but I also understand why fans would welcome Cowher. He reminds people of Ditka with the fiery attitude and coaching style. I want to see Lovie succeed and if for some reason he doesn’t, I would like to see us go with a coach that has more of a Ditka like attitude. SMASH MOUTH!! Not particularly Cowher though. I think Lovie and company will have a great season and we won’t even have to worry about that.

Hear about the blind hooker, you gotta hand it to her.

by Bears fan 4-ever!!! on May 11, 2009 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good point...

I hadn’t thought of the players not fitting into other peoples defense so they fall to us strategy. On the 3-4 list I’m sure you can add Cleveland, Baltimore and the Jets, the Ravens ran a 3-4, 4-3 hybrid last year under Ryan so I will assume that Ryan takes that with him to the Jets, and why would the Ravens try to fix a defense that isn’t broken.

On your NT wish list in the draft I see 3 players capable of filling that role in the 2010 draft, Ndamukong Suh from Nebraska, Terrence Cody from Alabama, and Gerald McCoy from Oklahoma. So if we were to switch to the 3-4 it would probably be the year to do so, but we would definantly have to trade way up in the draft to get one of those guys.

by chase17 on May 9, 2009 11:16 PM CDT reply actions  

Even Tampa isn't a Tampa-2 team any more

They’re staying as a 4-3, but under Jim Bates, they’re having to retool as well. Has anyone heard what Indy is doing with Dungy gone? They may be switching since the tampa two was his (and Kiffen’s) defense.
That being said, I wish we could have brought Herm Edwards in as our DB coach. He sucked as a HC, but would be an awesome fit with Lovie.

"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay

by JerBear50 on May 10, 2009 12:05 AM CDT reply actions  

Herm Edwards

is a rah-rah guy. He a motivator, not a scheme guy. I like what Hoke did in Houston, but truthfully, just not a Herm guy.

If God had wanted man to play soccer, he wouldn't have given us arms.- Mike Ditka

by Hurricanes becoming Bears on May 10, 2009 4:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

who cares what he'll do

his track record speaks for itself.

by tempchad on May 10, 2009 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

His track record with a team that was BUILT for his coaching style.

I’d love to have his temperament in a coach, but I’d prefer that we stay with the Cover-2 so that we don’t have to completely revamp the defense as stated above. The offense, on the other hand, could use a restructuring – keep Cutler, Forte, Olsen, and maybe the new draftees, but everyone else can go. No more FB Dives.

by bdalebs on May 10, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

a smart coach adapts to the talent he has

if this bears defense cant run a 3-4 (and i don’t think it would work) a smart coach would stick with what they do best. perhaps draft new players to play the 3-4 later on.

by tempchad on May 10, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Do we have proof that he'd be willing to adapt?

I thought he had his defense pretty much set when he started in Pitt, but I could be wrong.

by bdalebs on May 11, 2009 4:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

the bears don't have the players to play 3-4 even if he wanted to

we don’t have a nose tackle. we don’t have 3-4 ends. we don’t have a rush linebacker.

once we got those guys in they could switch but i just can’t see the 3-4 being effective with the personnel on hand.

i don’t see how a coach would come in and try to shove a square peg in a round hole.

in a few years after some drafts and free agent pickups i could see a change.

by tempchad on May 11, 2009 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Start the transistion with a complete implosion?

IDK why, but I feel like that’d be Cowher’s plan if he came here.

by bdalebs on May 11, 2009 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not mine.

Just what I think Cowher would do if he came to Chicago.

by bdalebs on May 13, 2009 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Indeed--much like his replacement

Mike Tomlin was known as a Cover-2 guy as a defensive coordinator, but has stuck with the 3-4 in Pittsburgh. That was the right move and it has paid off for them.

by TCBullfrog on May 11, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

I like the idea

of having our choice of cover-2 guys, but I am not so sure that the 3-4 and cover-2 are so mutually exclusive. Just off the top of my head I remember a NFL All Access where they discussed how the Steelers ran the cover-2 out of the 3-4 at least part of the time. I’m not a huge X’s and O’s guy but I know Madden 08 lets you run a cover-2 out of the 3-4.

Any thoughts Scepsy or GB? You seem to know this stuff pretty well.

If God had wanted man to play soccer, he wouldn't have given us arms.- Mike Ditka

by Hurricanes becoming Bears on May 10, 2009 4:12 AM CDT reply actions  

And I'll apologize in advance for screwing up your name

Sorry scespy12, it’s been a long night.

If God had wanted man to play soccer, he wouldn't have given us arms.- Mike Ditka

by Hurricanes becoming Bears on May 10, 2009 4:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

No prob....

Everyone gets it wrong:). Ummm 3-4 and cover-2 not exclusive cover-2 is not a base D but a set. The Tampa is exclusive from the 3-4 because of small differences.

The only players at really transfer over is the undertackle plays end in a 3-4

I've officially adopted #94 Marcus Harrison!

by scespy12 on May 10, 2009 10:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

cover-2 and a 3-4

are not mutually exclusive, but most teams that use cover-2 extensively, use a 4 man line. A 3 man front will not generate enough pressure for the cover-2 to work, requiring you to send a LB.

by lookingdeadred on May 10, 2009 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Personel wise

The LB who rushes is just a wash for a 4-3 d-end, sure, but you still need the linebacker who can drop into coverage. And I assume you would want big physical corners and ball hawks for safeties, whether you are in the 3-4 or 4-3 while running a cover-2. So would avoiding the 3-4 give a 4-3 team better choice of front seven guys but not secondary players? I don’t know. Maybe non-rushing outside linebackers and 3 technique tackles. 3-4 teams use 4-3 ends as rush backers, and 4-3 NT as ends so while I do think there is some advantage to staying in the 4-3 while the rest of the league changes to the 3-4, I don’t think it would be too great an advantage.

If God had wanted man to play soccer, he wouldn't have given us arms.- Mike Ditka

by Hurricanes becoming Bears on May 10, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah

but Lovie likes his d ends small, well, smaller than normal. A. Brown is 260 lbs, O-Gun is 260 as well, Anderson is 255. Now compare that to all the tweener guys, not quite DE’s, not quite OLB’s, in the draft this year. Maybin-250, Orakpoe-260, English 255, Brown 250, Barwin 255, Veikune 255, Kruger 260. All of these guys could have played up or down and you would be hard pressed to guess which they will play without knowing which team drafted them but even then some seem to go against logic. Orakpoe and Kruger, the biggest two, look like they’ll both play OLB, Maybin and Brown the lightest two, will play with a hand on the ground. And I believe if Lovie and J.A. had taken any of these guys they all would have played DE for us.

If God had wanted man to play soccer, he wouldn't have given us arms.- Mike Ditka

by Hurricanes becoming Bears on May 12, 2009 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

ORO?!

If you want to crown em...

by JohnnyTruant on May 10, 2009 10:10 AM CDT reply actions  

real good point

I’m a big fan of the 3-4 but it is getting so popular again, the Cover 2 is still a productive defense when run properly and with the correct personel

by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on May 10, 2009 12:25 PM CDT reply actions  

Lovie Smith isn't going anywhere

The 2009 Chicago Bears will be at least a decent enough team that Lovie Smith’s job security will once again be a non-issue. Talk of his replacement is silly and non-productive.

Bill Cowher is a bit of an assclown, but my opinion of him notwithstanding he is clearly holding out for either the Carolina or Jacksonville job to open. He lives in North Carolina with his wife and athlete daughters and wants very much to be able to coach close to his new adopted home. John Fox is on the hotseat in Carolina and if they falter in 2009 then Cowher is solidly in line to take that job. Or if Jack Del Rio trips up in Jacksonville.

by BLou on May 10, 2009 1:06 PM CDT reply actions  

Talk to me after we win the big one this year.

Screw Bill Cowher or any other coach. I want Lovie Smith coaching my Bears. He is gonna take us to the promised land, it is written, for such a time as this, God will raise up a man to lead the Bears back to glory, that man is Lovie Smith.

Passion For The Game, Loyal To The Name, Chicago Bears, I Trust In Thee, Standing Strong Since 1983.

by Haightminow on May 10, 2009 10:40 PM CDT reply actions  

Sure

But the third times the charm…right???

Unreasonable people make life difficult...

by WisBearsFan34 on May 11, 2009 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lovie is not Ditka eventhough

 he is not as worthless as those two retards.

Hear about the blind hooker, you gotta hand it to her.

by Bears fan 4-ever!!! on May 11, 2009 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lovie Smith isn't going anywhere

Fact is Lovie is a damned good football coach and a big asset to the Bears. The 2009 Bears would have to utterly collapse to the status of a 5-11 football team or something like that for there to even be a whiff of thought of firing Lovie.

by BLou on May 12, 2009 9:34 AM CDT reply actions  

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