Why All the Hate for Matt Forte and Greg Olsen !?

if the Bears need/want to make a trade, they have to trade a player that actually has value. Trades are not common in the NFL because there are simply too many positions to fill to have one player make that large a difference. That’s why the draft and FA are so much more important in the NFL offseason. But as far as a trade, Olsen and Forte are about the only players that might be “tradable”; save maybe Briggs or perhaps Hester. Thus I don’t see the “hate” you speak of as much as the “reality” of what would need to happen to make a trade possible.
However, neither guy would garner much on the open market except maybe a few mid round draft picks, so a trade would be too large a gamble. I think it’s safe to say that both guys will need to start producing at a higher level to have this talk subside; it’s not like either has played at a pro-bowl level recently. Nonetheless, they are good players with some potential and the Bears are better off keeping them than trading them.
Lastly, I hope many of the trade scenario idiots can just stop. NO TEAM will give the Bears their star DE or WR for Nate Vasher and a 6th round pick. Tommie Harris does not have trade value, much like most of the Bears players. That’s not a knock on many of those guys, it’s simply stating the reality that the Bears need to add talent and not trade it away for dubious draft picks.

…on the Forte/Olsen trade topic is that for this coming season we should stand pat and accept that with Coach Lovie Smith, Angelo, and Bigfoot Phillips we have the creators of what I like to call a wild card season. I mean that we are stuck with them at the helm, and pretty much have to play with the hand we have been dealt with the players we have. We have to hope for the team to gel, for lightning to strike and the team to hit on all cylinders. (How that for mixing metaphors? Continuing with that.) We could be getting on an express elevator to hell – going down! OR they might bogart to paydirt and actually make the playoffs. Aside from a free agent or two grabbed up, I don’t think we will see any major player movement. We can win with Forte and Olsen if we have some improvement on the OL and if the DL improves as well. I believe that if Urlacher comes back strong, the defense will experience a resurgence and this could make a huge difference. Either way, it would appear the die is cast for the upcoming season and we will just have to make lemonade out of lemons. (I think I shot my wad on the metaphors)

I disagree about Forte. His per touch numbers are ok, but only because his per reception numbers are through the roof.

Here’s why I have a problem with Forte….

1. He has never run for more than 3.9 yards per carry

1. He has never run for more than 2.2 yards after contact per carry

1. He has been the bottom ranked RB in running in the league for the past two seasons

1. He has been near the bottom in the previous two stats in both of his 2 years

Those, to me, are the most important stats for a RB. They indicate that he is neither elusive, nor a power runner.

I’ve been flamed for 2 days for making this statement, and that’s fine. But the biggest arguments seem to be that he has a horrible line, that he was hurt this season, that Orton was his QB in his rookie season, and that he had a great rookie year.

“Forte’s numbers are brought down by having a really bad line!”

That statement is true. No denying it. BUT, there is also no denying that for the past two seasons, every RB in the league who has run behind a lower ranked run-blocking unit has been ranked higher in running than Matt Forte. So why, with worse lines, are they getting more yards per carry and more yards after contact per carry? Is that not an indictment of Forte’s running ability?

“But Matt was hurt this season!”

Again, a true statement. And that injury definitely affected his stats…….in 2009. The injury does not explain away the fact that he was ranked last in the league in running out of 31 starting RBs in 2008. Nor does it explain why he was ranked 2nd from last in yards after contact per carry and 8th from last in yards per carry.

“Well, of course his numbers were lower. He was facing 8 man fronts because of Orton and the passing game”

Exhibit A: Kevin Smith 2008. Played for the 0-16 Lions who had the 30th ranked passing offense and the 29th ranked run blocking unit (Chicago’s rankings were 27th and 26th respectively). Yet Smith averaged 4.1 yards per carry, and 2.9 yards after contact per carry while facing 8 man fronts and playing on the worst team in history. Smith was 10th ranked in running. Forte was last.

Exhibit B: Jamaal Charles 2009: Played for a KC team that ranked 39th in passing offense and 29th in run blocking and put up five 100 yard games in eight stats (that’s as many as Forte has put up in 36 starts). He put up 5.9 yards a carry and 3.6 Yards after contact per carry. He was the 3rd ranked runner this year behind a worse line and with a worse passing offense and facing eight man fronts constantly.

“But he put up great numbers his rookie year!”
Sure. He was in incredible receiver out of the backfield (Best int he league in my opinion). But his numbers running were based on quantity, not quality. His averaged 3.9 YPC, and 2.2 Yards After Contact Per Carry. Those numbers place him squarely in the bottom 10 of starters as far as running is concerned. Should also be noted that he was a very good blocker his rookie year (something that was often overlooked, and was horribly affected by his injury this season)

I personally like Forte. I think he’s a great kid. I’m not some “everyone on the Bears sucks” kind of guy. But Matt’s skill set is that of a Receiving Fullback (and an exceptional one). I would love to see him put on 15 or 20 lbs and become the best fullback in the league. He can block well, and he can catch with the best (the guy was the top ranked receiving halfback and the 4th ranked blocking HB in the league his rrookie year) and he could be incredible in the backfield with a strong running HB.

As far as Olsen goes, the Bears don’t ask him to pass block, and his run blocking has improved enough for him to be ranked in the middle of the pack, and Above, Shockey, Shiancoe, Clark, V Davis, Gates, Celek, Lee, F Davis and others. The development of the receiving corps will pull some double coverage away from Greg, and his catch percentage and YAC will raise. Olsen is getting way to much heat for doing exactly what he is asked to do while taking double coverage consistently. I posted a bunch of links to video of Olsen and what he was doing and dealing with on Rakman’s thread.

No one can agree to disagree and let the cards play out. The combine will be good for this website, we need some new fodder. Now as far as the post is concerned I feel we should keep both, but this has been a topic that has been talked about at nauseum for days. This debate has gone on long enough as well as the ALL POPULAR Devin Hester debate.

Either we all need to meet up and fight this out ( I call Irish Bears) or we need to agree to disagree. And put these cliche disputes to the side. Cause lets get real, none of these guys are going to be gone.

That being said if ANY of you say anything about Hester, its on!!!! hahaha : )

punt.

I don’t agree completely with the analysis, but it was a well though out post, and someone should rec it.

Come on, Forte and Olsen defenders! Give MidWay a little love…..

If Martz has a decent running back he will use him. Faulk had some great years with him including the 1000 rec. yards and 1000 rushing yards. As i said all year I dont care whos back there (unless its walter) if your constantly getting hit behind the line of course youll avg below 4 yards what do you expect? Forte had a good finish especially the minnesota game yes it was only 71 yards but it was against a good defense in the vi QUEENS and those yards allowed cutler to pick them apart. For those who thought Fortes rookie year was a fluke…well why were his receiving numbers about the same?

Olsen- People need to give me a valid reason for not liking him. not this b.s.
Olsen cant Block- Neither can gates or dallas clark
Olsen drops the ball- really? check the stats.
Olsen cant make a tough catch- view his catches vs atlanta and the steelers where he was ripping the ball away from defends and taking devastating shots and getting back up

………. gotta love it . What you ask ? Back up ! Apperciate Bear Lovin 21 !

Forte had a great rookie year, and he did’t get bad overnight. I believe the MCL story, and he should be a lot better next year as long as we get the blocking together. No way we trade him.

Olsen is a different story. Martz hasn’t kept it a secret that tight ends that can’t block won’t feature in his scheme. Tory Holt backed that up. That opens things up for Clarke and Davis. And Davis can block, I saw him pancake two guys on one play. You don’t do that unless you’re physical. Olsen avoids contact like the plague. They won’t trade him, but there will be sparks between Martz and Olsen this year. They’ll persist with him because he’s Jerry’s boy, he won’t keep up his end of the blocking agreement, the running game will stall, fireworks on the sideline.

im with you here bro. Well said. I agree 100%

Some of us might get up on one or more players …… we want the roster changed … it might come across as hate, but we just want a better team. I was Olsen’s biggest fan going into this year – I thought he would strike something up with Cutler. He turned out to be a mirage. If he did anything, he distracted Cutler, because he went looking for Olsen at the detriment of open receivers elsewhere. There are justifiable reasons for trading Olsen – Olsen has still got some trade value and we need picks. He has no use in the new offense. Hester is not contributing well enough in the receiving game. Also cannot block and won’t find a spot on the field because of that. If he’s not going back on returns – then why keep him ? Sell him while’s relatively hot. There are no justifiable reasons for trading Forte.