Making the Case: Anything but Offensive Line in the 3rd is a mistake.
Everyone saw the poll a few days ago here on our very own WCG, and there wasn't a whole lot of surprise that the top four positions of interest were Tackle/Guard/Defensive End/Free Safety. What was a lot more surprising to me is that both FS and DE received more votes than either of the offensive line positions. I hate to step out on a limb and get combative with folks, but I would like to do some serious clarification here. Our biggest needs should NOT be our biggest targets in the draft, if you think DE and FS are those biggest needs. Follow me below the fold while I explain myself further.
So first let us establish a few givens. We're mostly Bears fans here, which means we historically enjoy a great defense the way most fans would enjoy a great offense. There is nothing wrong with that, and well with our defensive issues the past few years I can definitely sympathize and understand where there is a huge desire to bolster our defense this off season. However, just because our defense needs bolstering does not make the draft the place to do it.
The NFL Draft is a very unique animal when it comes to the ranking of positions. Sure some positions require more skill, some are "worth" more on the open market, but the extremes the NFL draft takes this position valuation to is something bordering on fantasy. For instance, you can usually make an easy bet that at least three LT will be taken before a G ever comes off the board. You can also be fairly safe with a bet that places RB/WR before TE, and that no FB will be picked before the 3rd round at the earliest. Also, Robbie Gould, even if he re-entered the draft right now, would be lucky to be picked in the 4th round.
What does all of this mean? It means that when you're dealing with draft day you have to look at not only the depth of the position in this draft, but also it's relative value towards your needs; and the strength of the pick on its own two feet. For instance, a lot of the time you'll find a fairly noticeable drop off in game ready talent after the top 5 at any position in the draft, and an even more noticeable drop off in talent after the top 10. Good scout work can help find the diamonds in the rough, but in general you're not going to find the next Orlando Pace in the sixth round. So when you're ranking your needs it's very important to compare your list of needs to the positions of value, and where your picks correlate to the best chance of filling those holes on your roster.
Why does all of this matter to our current situation? It matters because Defensive Ends are extremely popular in the first two rounds of the draft, severely diluting the remaining talent pool by the third round. Generally if you're after a DE and he's still there in the third, he's probably going to be there in the fourth as well, and even if not someone usually will be that isn't that far off your talent evaluation of the guy you wanted in the third. The groupings are much closer together talent-wise after the first two rounds.
It also matters because S is traditionally not a deep position, and hasn't been for quite some time. This year is starting out a bit different with quite a few early entries trying to get in before the lock out. My last count was that there were about eight safeties that had a 2nd round grade or better, and even more that were just off the bubble as third or fourth round picks. This is quite a bit different than most years as S is usually an extremely underrepresented position. What this means is that this year you're still going to have those two or three fantastic "can't miss" players that are picked in the first and early second, but there are going to be a lot of quality safeties falling down the draft board. This isn't the place for predictions, but don't be surprised to see the Bears pick up Myron Lewis in the 4th or 5th round as he's not only a taller guy with a knack for coming up with the ball, but he projects as a FS/Cover2CB and he's from Vandy. Value + Need + Vandy = Bears are grabbing him.
Now despite my prediction I really don't care who the Bears pick up to play FS, but it's very important to note that there are more 2nd round or better safeties in this coming draft than have been picked in total through the first five rounds on average going back about 10 years. This means that grabbing a safety in the 3rd round when there is going to be a huge amount of quality left is foolish since there is still going to be quality going all the way to the 5th round.
Now I can hear you saying now, who cares where we pick the guy as long as we get our guy? I agree completely in a perfect world, but this isn't a perfect world. We're hamstrung with very few picks in an extremely deep draft class, and our needs on the offense are at keystone positions along the line. The only thing worse than rebuilding a line is being forced to do it again two years later when you realize the guy you got isn't your guy. That's why it's important to go offensive lineman with our first pick. RT are always at less of a premium than LT, and this is turning out to be a fairly deep class of tackles meaning: we're likely going to have our pick of the top two or three RT in the draft with our first pick of the draft. Guards are historically even less valued than RT with all but the best of the crop falling into the late second at best. You combine that with a really deep T class, and you're probably going to see some really good guards still on the board even in the fourth round and later.
We're in a unique position folks, and the thing about unique positions is that they haven't been done that many times before and are open to being resolved in different ways than your standard "I need a QB so let's grab the best QB on the board ". We have realistic openings across the line, Garza has one, possibly two years left so for all intents and purposes his position is open in the mid to late term, we have two open positions at LG and RT. This means while we don't have a lot of picks, and we have very specific needs, they run the gamut across the line enough to allow us to pick for the best player available to fill one of multiple needs, and to likely do so again in the fourth.
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To summarize: We need to address the DE position outside the draft, the position isn't deep enough and is too popular to have anything but extremely depleted talent left in the third. FS, while a definite need, is extremely stacked this year with quality and the drop off is going to be much less severe from the third to the fifth round. Our three needs, RT/LG and to a lesser extent RG, give us flexibility to get the absolute best linemen left on the board in the third round as well as being less "important" positions making the likelihood of finding a foundational player for the team going into the future much more likely.
My suggestion is to go either RT/LG in the third, BPA between what you didn't pick adding FS in the fourth, and BPA between what's left in the fifth adding RG. The likelyhood of us filling all three positions isn't terrible, and fairly high of hitting two out of three. Combine that with a DE from FA and we should have a fairly significant boost specially for a team without a first day pick.
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Dude i love this guy
No it All your hilarious!
but all honesty if we dont get rolle in free agency id love to see Chancellor force butter fingers (adrian peterson) to fumble on a regular basis
by Bear Lovin 21 on Feb 25, 2010 7:36 PM CST up reply actions
What's with all the Kam Chancellor Love around here?
Everyday I read someone (maybe its the same people, haven’t looked closely) raving abou this guy. Why? He doesn’t even crack the top 10 in many of the overall safety rankings. We haven’t seen him at the combine to get a sense of his real traits. From what I can tell, there’s a good chance he’ll be there in the 4th— maybe even beyond that. I know there is a good highlight reel of him on YouTube and he has a cool name and all but I need to hear a more compelling story about why this guy who is projected as a SS and not a FS is such a great solution for the Bears….
I tried to email you, but it keeps sending it back with an error, so I give up.
"How sad, another victim of the Night Nurses from Jersey."
you could email me if you have trouble reaching Dane
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Feb 26, 2010 12:35 PM CST up reply actions
For sure......
I cant send to anyone though, Ive tried.
"How sad, another victim of the Night Nurses from Jersey."
then it's on your end
I get emails all the time from the link WCG provides on the bottom of the page… wiltfongjr@gmail.com
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Feb 26, 2010 1:45 PM CST up reply actions
Size as well
He’s probably has the reputation as a “big” hitter too.
"The country is full of good coaches. What it takes to win is a bunch of interested players." -Don Coryell, ex-San Diego Chargers Coach
*he*
Darn edit fail of my post messed me up!
"The country is full of good coaches. What it takes to win is a bunch of interested players." -Don Coryell, ex-San Diego Chargers Coach
…who posts here as our very own No It All…..
"F*** everybody outside of Halas Hall. BEARDOWN" - WavyGravy
"if we need it, we’re not drafting it. not high anyway. look for Angelo to go after a DL/DE – because that’s just the kind of asshat he is.." - junkhorse
"44 years of football history and nothing to show for it. I wish I wasn’t banned at the Norseman.." - tfrabotta
Actually have to say you make a compelling argument...
and I tend to agree that DE cannot be had past the 3rd round usually, with a few very rare exceptions. 1st and 2nd round guys are about 50-50 at making an immediate/first season impact on any given team. Where we disagree is at the safety position. Safeties, especially free safeties are difficult to find. Guys who are fast enough come out as “DBs” if they did not primarily play CB. That leaves very few true FS candidates who actually have experience at FS. If the draft class is truly deep at FS, and let’s face it, these draft geniuses are guessing just like the rest of us, then the Bears are more likely to get a true impact FS in the 3rd round. I agree that O-line could be the next 2 picks, and for the reasons you’ve stated, the Bears can get a damn good G and T for a 4th-5th round value pick. Add to that the possibility of a decent CB or RB or DT in that mix as well and the Bears could fill out a decent roster and get some developmental guys as well. The issue does revolve around 2 problems:
1. The Bears lack enough picks to get players in the draft or trade the picks for players
and
2. The Bears will have to spend money in FA wisely to be able to get enough players to compensate for the lack of draft picks.
IT'S NOT TOO LATE TO FIRE LOVIE!
Normally I'd agree with your assessment of the S...
But this year is an anomaly for the position, with 15+ guys with at least 4th round grades, and eight of those guys having 2nd round grades, including 3 first rounders.
There hasn’t been 8 safeties picked in the first two rounds going back like twenty years so it’s extremely likely that a lot of quality safeties are going to be dropping like a rock, a lot more so than say G or T, since there are always a ton of these chosen.
You’re just going to see a lot more of a decline between our third round selection and our fourth round selection when it comes to OLine vs S. We can probably get a top 10 G/RT since we’re not exactly picky at the position, while waiting to the fourth round will likely see the bones picked a bit more clean.
Long story short, this is one of the few years that the talent pool for offensive line will deplete faster than at S.
Associate Writer - WindyCityGridiron.com
Let's face it...
it’s tough at this point because FA period isn’t even in motion. I agree the value of a position and its projected depth are often the basic consideration, but JA, IMO, tends to “out think” himself a bit too often. Sometimes it’s better to “overdraft” a better player that can fill a need. It’s so difficult to get past a Haynes and Bauzin pick, when, much as you correctly point out, the draft classes had better talent that went much farther down. Perhaps, instead of trying to find a serviceable backup with 5 picks in the 7th round, they could simply pick the “BPA” that they so often seem to miss in the early rounds.
My biggest concern is that they wait until the 5th or 6th round to get a FS and end up with the 8th or 9th best safety in the draft. In Lovie’s version of the Tampa2 defense, the FS is one of the most important positions. It’s too important to hope the 8th best safety in the draft is going to be able to get it done. If they don’t make an attempt to get that solved short or long term, they will continue to fail miserably and waste the careers of many players, not just the safeties they draft.
IT'S NOT TOO LATE TO FIRE LOVIE!
Excellent Point
Missed is the Point that JA has a relatively poor track record in the draft.
Bears frequently try to take BPA, without reagrd to their needs. That’s why I’ve been saying he takes a LB, why??? Because we don’t need one, and at our point in the draft there are likely to be some very good ones available, and a LB may well be the BPA.
The draft is like a poker game, you know what your cards are, but what the hell are you gonna do with ‘em?? The hand we got this year is like a King high. Can’t do much with it.
by Suffering from Chicago Sports on Feb 27, 2010 12:52 PM CST up reply actions
I'd say our hand is much more like pocket 2's.
It may turn into something better, and has a bit of promise, but isn’t worth a lot on its own.
Associate Writer - WindyCityGridiron.com
I say get Defense (DE and FS) is Free Agency
Then you are free to use the draft picks on the best T/G available since Omiyale can play both positions.
I think I need to fix this:
since Omiyale can playbothneither positions.
by Mike Mueller on Feb 25, 2010 10:17 PM CST up reply actions
So am I
I find my bank with greater ease every week.
by Suffering from Chicago Sports on Feb 27, 2010 12:48 PM CST up reply actions
This approach makes sense to me
which means the convoluted Bears will probably do the opposite, like picking a RB or another TE with their top pick!!
ba-zing
Do or do not there is not try-Master Yoda
by suckmyditka on Feb 26, 2010 11:32 AM CST up reply actions
It really depends
what they end up doing with Omi. Well thought out post, but it’s really all speculation until FA starts. Your suggestions or projections for the Bears make a ton of sense, especially since RT and G tend to be drafted in the 2-5 rounds. I can see your prediction coming true if the Bears sign a DE and FS through FA. That would fill two huge holes before they pick in the 3rd round. This may be the first year where JA signs defense in FA, and selects offensive players in the draft.
"The country is full of good coaches. What it takes to win is a bunch of interested players." -Don Coryell, ex-San Diego Chargers Coach
I expect they will fill one with cement.
The McCaskey’s are too cheap to spend the money in FA to fill ‘em both. We’ll be lucky to get one filled.
by Suffering from Chicago Sports on Feb 27, 2010 12:54 PM CST up reply actions
i'm one of the few who voted for G in the poll
and I agree with you. We should definately get Oline help via the draft and try to get as much defensive help via FA. There are some decent players available in FA: Peppers, Kampmann, Rolle,Sharper. If we can get some solid players in FA it makes our options in the draft much more clear. I havent heard of any Oline players being available in FA. If there are some can someone please list them for me.
Free Safety needs to be addressed when we can afford to address it ...
We need a Mike Brown. We don’t have the picks to get one, so go out and pay Sharper and Peppers whatever they want (Sharper on a one year contract). Draft a free safety in the first round next year … we’ve got a third rounder this year, I mean who cares …? Combine that third with Olsen though …. and we might nab somebody …
by Irish Bears Fan on Feb 26, 2010 3:28 AM CST reply actions
Teams can get
quality at FS in the 3rd round, especially in this year’s draft.
"The country is full of good coaches. What it takes to win is a bunch of interested players." -Don Coryell, ex-San Diego Chargers Coach
I will agree
we should use our 3rd pick on a guard. But i think DE and FS are our most needed positions.
Rhodes Scholar?
With Myron Rolle in the draft and most likely available in our draft spot, why would we go with anyone else? He going to be the steal of a lifetime for whomever drafts him.
Amen to that. What you consider a strength can become a weakness quickly in this league.
Injuries can change your needs overnight. Always draft the player with best potential, with secondary consideration given to position. We thought we were set at the safety position after the SB and have been searching for a good one since then. We thought the same about RB after the SB year. How’d that work out for us?
by BigGeorgeTX on Feb 26, 2010 10:03 AM CST up reply actions
I think JA will take the highest rated player on his board
And I think Omiyale will start at either RT or LG next year depending on who is brought in. I’d like to see an upgrade at LG allowing Omiyale to play RT. In the Martz system you need a better pass blocker at RT and he’s better than Shaffer.
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Feb 26, 2010 10:17 AM CST up reply actions
This Offseason
Our first pick this year should be used on a right tackle to fit Martz’s scheme. I don’t think Omiyale will be moved from LG. He was brought in for that position because the Bears brass felt Josh Beekman wasn’t good enough to start. That feeling didn’t change after last season when Omi was replaced by Beekman and he couldn’t hold down that spot. Also, another reason to go tackle in the 3rd is because this unrestricted free agent class. Anybody worth pursuing will be tagged or have a high tender as a RFA. The same goes for the guard position.
Look for DE, FS, CB in free agency. Go RT in the 3rd round and the remaining rounds find the best players available.
Here’s a nice article by Jon Greenburg from ESPN Chicago. LINKERS
by boondock_saint812 on Feb 26, 2010 10:16 AM CST reply actions
If you forced me to pick an order right now...
It’d be RT/G, whoever is the BPA in the third, and then best FS available in the 4th, likely Myron Lewis, but I’d be fine with a lot of the other suggestions like Kam and others. Then the best G prospect we can grab in the fifth round.
We’d get a starter for the line, a very likely starter at FS, and someone to develop to take over for Garza in a year or so.
Associate Writer - WindyCityGridiron.com
ugh...
like i said before, DE can be fixed via an open pocketbook on julius peppers…but I still think we should dive for a FS in the 3rd round…if there really are 8 2nd round+ quality safeties, they will be gone by the 4th except for 1-2 iffy ones..whereas a couple good ones will be left by the 3rd. Realistically we just need a LG for our offensive line and omiyale back at RT…seeing as well…he is a tackle..but i think the bears forgot to read that part when he handed them his resume. Anyway, facing reality here…fixing our O line in the draft isn’t going to happen with our low picks..we should just be looking for a stopgap or two 4th round down and hoping they turn out better than projected.

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