Could Kevin Curtis be Chicago bound ?
by MidWayMonster54 on Mar 18, 2010 5:43 PM CDT
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PrintEarlier today the Eagles released vetran Kevin Curtis . He seems to be a great fit for our wide recievers unit that needs a veteran presence . Also this guy is only 2 years removed from a 77 catch season in which ne posted 1110 yards and 6 TD's . He's 31 years old and could come at a relatively inexpensive contract .
Another link to Curtis is he played in Martz's system in St. Louis and could be used to help our young wide outs learn Martz's complex system . Curtis seems to be a more viable option than Torry Holt at this point and would definitly be the cheaper option . Both are at points in their careers where injuries are starting to catch up with them , but Curtis is younger ( 31 to Holts 33 ) and has less wear and tear on his body . On the other hand Holt has been more productive ( see Holts stats here ) ( see Curtis' stats here ) and has openly lobbied to be a Chicago Bear ( check here for the complete story ) . The downside to Holt ......... his contract demands could be significantly greater than Curtis .
So which would be the greater benefit to our team Holt or Curtis ? Or do you think we have what we need at wide out and just need to leave it be ?
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Holt
Anybody that thinks this WR corp is fine, is on something. Yes, they all have potential. But when Devin Hester is your veteran WR, you have a problem. Holt has the chance to be very productive in this offense because of his familiarity of it and the fact that Cutler likes to throw the ball. Holt is Top 3 route running WR in this league the past decade and he will not only benefit this team this year, he would for the future as well because he can teach this young and inexperienced group, that has a lot of potential, how to run a freaking route.
Where did you find the stats for...
Holt being top 3 route runner?
I know he is good but i would like to see where they keep that “route running” stat.
Nevertheless
The wide outs will be fine. I am not opposed to bringing in a veteran reciever, but it would not hurt my feelings if we just kept the guys we have where they are at.
Let them settle into their roles, why bring someone in that will shake up the line-up asnd possibley stunt the growth of a johnny knox or Aromashudu.
Do or do not there is not try-Master Yoda
by suckmyditka on Mar 18, 2010 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Stats?
I don’t know if there are stats or not. I remember watching NFL Network a couple years ago and all the analysts saying that Holt is the best route runner in the league. You can take that with a grain of salt. Fact of the matter, compared to the Bears WR, Holt is the greatest route runner in the history of the league.
There’s 2 ways to look at this WR corp. They are very poor route runners and attributed to Cutler’s INTs making him look very poor. Or they are very good route runners and Cutler just sucks. For the sake of this franchise, I’m hoping its the first one. Because if it’s because Cutler sucks, then this franchise is in trouble.
I said above that this group has potential. But they are very inexperienced. The Bears need some veteran leadership to help this group. It’s not going to stunt the growth of DA or Knox if Holt is signed. It will improve their growth because they would be learning from one of the best WR to play this game.
Alot of what you say
is based on pure opinion.
I don’t care how many people on NFL network are considered NFL “experts”
Saying Tory Holt is the greatest route runner in the league is pure opinion.
Because until they make an official stat out of route running, we will never know that
Do or do not there is not try-Master Yoda
by suckmyditka on Mar 19, 2010 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Reading is fundamental
Not on any of my posts did I say Holt was the greatest route runner in the league. I said he was Top 3 the past decade and based that off the fact that NFL analysts said he was the best. Now you can say you don’t care about what these so called experts say but fact is, these guys are NFL or ex-NFL players so I’ll take their words for it. They know a hell of a lot more about this subject then you, me, or this whole blog combined.
Of course is based on opinion. I’m not associated with the NFL in anyway shape or form. Your statement that my statements are based on opinions is an opinion.
90% of what we read is pure opinion
That does not make it invalid, any more that stats make something more true.
Stats can be spun in multiple directions.
I don’t know if Holt is a great route runner, but he most have had something on the ball to get as far as he got as a WR.
As for the topic as raised by MidwayMonster54, I don’t think Curtis would be worth acquiring. Would he help our team? I don’t think so.
I agree with suckmyditka – if we stand pat on the receivers we have, I would have no problem with that.
Absent being able to sign a top 10 WR, and we don;t have the ammo to do that anyway.
"Do or do not... there is no try." - Yoda
Then you didn't watch Jaguar games last year.
The Rams were right about him and about Pace.
Holt is beyond done.
????
I actually watched quite a few Jags games last season (several of my fantasy players were on that team). I’m not sure what you saw, but Holt did very well last season. His presence had a lot to do with the emergence of Sims-Walker, as well. He still ran great routes, had great hands, and caught well in traffic. He doesn’t have the speed any more, but he was still a above average receiver, and his stat line supports that.
So what did you see that was different?
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 19, 2010 9:57 PM CDT up reply actions
meh
much better ways to spend our money
"If I were a food critic being asked to write about the meal and experience at Waffle House, I would provide a drawing of two happy fat people giving each other a high five."
by BearNecessities on Mar 19, 2010 5:11 AM CDT reply actions
Is Curtis right?
Or Holt for that matter? No need signing a broken down veteran.
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Mar 19, 2010 8:47 AM CDT reply actions
One of the speculated reasons Holt
didn’t come here last year, was because of questions about his knees i thought, or at least his ability to play in Soldier Field… how does one more year make that any better?
"If I were a food critic being asked to write about the meal and experience at Waffle House, I would provide a drawing of two happy fat people giving each other a high five."
by BearNecessities on Mar 19, 2010 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions
I think we need verterians on this team
Hester going back to kick offs frees up 1 spot..In martz offense hes uses 3 to 5 Wr sets.i would try to sign both these guys to be honest .I dont wanna see what i seen last yr again.if we sign just il be happy also..But cutler needs a dependable wr bottom line.
I don't know about signing verterians........
But Senator DeMint might know what you were talking about (pops. Take a look at the address and the tag line, lol)
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 19, 2010 10:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Does Kevin Curtis bring leadership qualities with him?
Because something the Bears really are still lacking is leadership in the locker room. When you don’t get it from the coach it has to come from somewhere.
bears lack locker room leadership?
when did Olin retire?
You can't see California without Marlon Brando's eyes.
by ifuwannacrownem on Mar 19, 2010 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
Well played sir
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 19, 2010 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, I'm late to this party as usual.
It gets me a bit flustered when people on the internet come across as having knowledge of what goes on in the Bears lockerroom.
I’d love to know where you get the info of which you speak (lacking leadership in the lockerrom and not getting it from the coach). Tell us about what goes away from the cameras, away from the media. Tell us about the team meetings… tell us about the lockerrom presence of the leaders of our team. Tell us about our coaches and how they interact with our players.
Neither
If I were forced to take one. It would be Curtis in a second.
Holt is done.
How's he done?
In 15 games (12 starts), Holt caught 51 balls for 722 for a 14.2 avg. and 0 TDs. Now, his 51 recs would have been 3rd best among WRs on the Bears, his 722 yds would have been 2nd, his 14.2 avg would have led all Bear players that caught a ball, and his TDs sucked. Considering that he’s done and still was better than most Bears WRs speaks volumes about the current WR corp.
Here's how I look at the Holt situation
Holt was supposed to be the man for the Jags and he wasn’t. Mike-Sims Walker was.
Holt signed a three-year, $12.45 million deal with the Jaguars last April. He carried a base salary of $4.45 million for 2010. They released him in February. The Jags obviously didn’t think much of Holt or they would’ve kept him around. Look at what they have…
Current Jags WRs.
Mike-Sims Walker, Kassim Osgood, Troy Williamson and some guys I’ve never heard of before.
I’d take our current WR corp over the Jag’s in a Billy Gillispie minute. So why would we want to add someone to our crop of WRs that wasn’t good (or cost effective) enough to stick were he was already signed?
This is not a knock on Ripper at all
but a lot of people can be perceived to be better than they are, or worse, according to mainstream media, and we buy it. look at the combine… peoples’ careers can be put on hold for years, because of a bad 40 time.
Some players are just labele this or that, at the outset of their career, and thats it for them. Holt is one that will be regarded as “great” or “at least better than what we have” until our WR go out and prove otherwise.
I think our WRs are fine, and somebody will be in the qualifying #1 category this year…all though that’s balogna as well, and yes I am aware of the Andre Johnson’s, Randy Moss’ of the world that are the exception to every rule.
"If I were a food critic being asked to write about the meal and experience at Waffle House, I would provide a drawing of two happy fat people giving each other a high five."
by BearNecessities on Mar 19, 2010 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions
what i think
I honestly wouldnt mind to have either one of them. But why not start our own era of the greats show of sod lol. Yes our WR corp is really young but look at all the potential. Each wideout we have are good at different things and i believe once martz figures out who he is gonna put where in different situations,we really could be dangerous this upcoming season!!!!!!!!!!!!
by CuTler2bearz on Mar 19, 2010 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Absolutely
And Holt was a great WR, just not anymore IMO. For the record, I wanted Holt in a Bears uniform last year… But not this year and after.
I thought it an intruiging idea last year too
but that was because of a gigantic question mark at the position. we now have at least a glimpse of what we can have going here. I like it. Holt now wants to play for us cause he saw us grab Cutler, he launched 3600 yds and now we have Martz… too bad so sad Holt.
remember though, last year people wanted Mike Furrey too. there is no reason to replace our up and coming WR with old and busted, or equally matched mediocrity, if say, DeSean Jackson, was available via Free Agency…sure, grab him. but a back fill guy…meh, all i see is money being taken away from the Atogwe deal we could be doing
"If I were a food critic being asked to write about the meal and experience at Waffle House, I would provide a drawing of two happy fat people giving each other a high five."
by BearNecessities on Mar 19, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
agreed!!
now only if JA would read these post!!!!!!!!!!!
by CuTler2bearz on Mar 19, 2010 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I understand what you are saying
I really do. Fact is, Holt was Top 5 WRs the past decade. The Bears WR can use the help. It’s no different if the Bears had drafted a QB with loads of potential and had a potential HOF QB come in and mentor him. Most fans would welcome that.
But that's not really fair to Holt
The Jaguars aren’t exactly a passing team. Sims-Walker did in fact have a great year and I bet if you talked to him he would probably tell you how Holt helped him become a better WR. If you look at his prior stats, you would have thought he was a WR for the Bears. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that he had a breakthrough season in Holt’s first year on the team. Whether it be Holt’s tutelage or defensives gameplanning for Holt and not Sims-Walker.
All I’m saying is that Holt can still be productive in this league. When he had a terrible year according to most people, he was still more productive than most of the Bears WR. If he can come cheap, he should be signed. If he wants big money, then they should pass on him. He doesn’t have the speed but he’d be a reliable target on 3rd downs and I don’t think his knowledge of the system should be underestimated at all.
Everyone argues that this WR corp is fine. Not bloody likely. When your #1 WR is still learning the position, you are doomed with a capital F. They have all the potential in the world and I think the Bears should do whatever it takes to maximize that potential and having them learn from a HOF WR could be a good start. Lord knows the Bears coaches can’t develop them.
Also silly...
to argue that the Jags let him go because they didn’t think much of him. They let him go because he had a $4½M contract. Had he been more reasonably paid, he would likely still be a jag.
The only thing that really concerns me about Holt is our field conditions on his knees. I see bad things happening to Holt on our worst in the league surface.
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 19, 2010 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Why dont the Bears get that field fixed?
I think people are assuming that Holt is gonna take all the snaps from our Younger receivers, which i dont think is gonna happen…There’s alot to be said about having another wideout that knows Martz’s system inside out and our young guys can go to him if they have a question about any routes or what they should do in a particular situation. There is no way he would stunt the growth of our guys. He isnt one of those prima donna wideouts. he is a consummate professional that will do whatever is asked of him without saying a word..ANY player like that will only improve a team imho
Kobe isnt good....He's just better than your favorite player
I don't find it silly at all
Absolutely his contract was the main contributing factor for his release. But it was Holt’s contract to play up to and he didn’t.
If I pay a guy 4,000 bucks for a job and he tells me that he’s worth every penny…
But as it turns out he’s only was worth about half that amount…
I’m not gonna think much of him from a business standpoint.
Sure....
But then you aren’t working in the professional sports field, where age brings decline on a yearly basis. But, to be fair, Holt had a very good year on a very bad team. Sims-Walker had a breakout year, true enough, and that moved Holt to second fiddle. But Sims -Walker credits Holt with teaching him. The Jags entered last season with a very young group of receivers. They then Brought in Holt to help them learn. He did exactly that, while catching for mare yards than any Bears receiver. Not exactly bad for a guy you brought in to be a mentor. The Bears could use that. Signing Holt to a 1 year deal certainly couldn’t hurt anything. But if he can have an impact like he did in JAX on our young receivers, then why would anyone have a problem with that.
History says that he can………………What says he can’t, again?
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 22, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
You say,
Holt had a very good year. I say not really. And definitely not for what he was paid.
You say JAX brought him in to be a mentor. I say they brought him in to be the man.
IF Holt was willing to come in on the cheap. Maybe signing him wouldn’t be a bad thing. Sure, he could help acclimate our young WR’s to the new system. I admit thereis value in that. But it’s also what we pay coaches for.
I personally wouldn’t want Holt taking snaps from Bennett, Aromashodu, Knox or Hester. And I’m confident Holt isn’t coming along with us to play special teams. So, I’m gonna say no thanks. Maybe if he’s willing to come in real cheap and real humble, I’d reconsider.
Funny how snarky....
people get about a future hall-of-famer. Guy must be like chewing gum. Flavors gone, toss him out. ’Cept……..
Holt was expected to be the #1, sure enough. But do your really think that the Jags brought in a slowed and hobbled future hall-of-famer because they thought he would be the answer for the three years they signed him for? Or even the answer for that year? Honestly? They brought in Holt because he still has enough in the tank to draw attention, which he did, effectively providing the same buffer for the young Jags. And Mike Sims-Walker flourished and grew.
Effectively, they paid Holt less than $3½M (and his cap hit was the same) in 2009 to help advance the young receivers while still pitching in 50+ and 700+. Not a bad investment, considering that we paid Devin Hester $5¾M (and took a near $7M cap hit)for a couple more catches, and few more yards. Devin did score 3 TDs, so effectively the Bears paid Devin $750K per TD, and Sims-Walker got a role model for free.
I’m not saying that to dis Hester, but to put into perspective exactly what Holt brought to the Jags, and why the Jags never likely expected to keep him for more than a season.
As to the coaching thing, yep, we pay coaches to acclimate players. One of those tools that is often used is to bring in a system veteran to help guide the players.
As far as pay goes, though. I agree. It all depends on the money. But then, again, if the bears have the cash in an uncapped year to sign Holt to a contract, then I say do it, without regard to the cost. If he isn’t working out, cut him. But if he can provide the same mentoring that he provided for Mike Sims-Walker to DA, Hester, Bennett and Knox then you have to.. If even one of those WRs reacts with similar results to what we saw out of Sims-Walker, then $5M would be easily worth it. Whatever it takes to develop these receivers, I say do it. Every little but helps. And as far as taking catches away from receivers goes, I agree to a point. But if those catches pay dividends in the form of the other young receivers improving, then I say catch away.
Worried about a roster spot? We paid Rasheed Davis almost a quarter million per catch last year. I think the $68K a catch that was Torry Holt last season would be a better investment.
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 24, 2010 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
do your really think that the Jags brought in a slowed and hobbled future hall-of-famer
You said it yourself, slowed & hobbled
Or even the answer for that year?
Absolutely I believe that’s what they thought
And to your point regarding Hester and Davis and bad investments. For me, a bad investment is just that. Just because one investment may be worse than another, doesn’t make it a good one.
Possibly I’m a little too close in time to our last future hall of fame investment.
I find the Holt situation nearly identical to that of Pace. Both future Hall of Fame members. Both had years that were well below what we’ve come accustomed to seeing. Both were released, because they failed to live up to their contracts.
Maybe if he’s willing to come in real cheap and real humble, I’d reconsider.
I agree, that was snarky.
If Holt comes to Chicago and has a better year than he did last, while improving our WR’s to a similar degree, that of Mike Sims-Walker. I’ll be the first to say, I’m stupid. You’re smart. I was wrong. You were right. You’re the best. I’m the worst. You’re very good-looking. I’m not attractive.
LMAO!!!!!!
Dude, I disagree about Holt, but I can’t even discuss it anymore. That was low. You used my own post to shut me up………..lmfao!
I knew there was a reason I liked you :)
in•san•i•ty \in-ˈsa-nə-tē\ noun
1 : The act of doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.
by Timothy Hockemeyer on Mar 26, 2010 7:42 AM CDT up reply actions
We need a wideout that knows Martz's system inside out
He can help the other young receivers tremendously and wouldnt hurt their growth but speed it up and improve it imo….Nobody is saying for him to come in and be the number 1 WR, but his knowledge of how Martz wants things done and the CORRECT way in how to go about doing it shouldnt be undervalued..People put to much emphasis on speed, but if you run Perfect routes you will still get open and move the chains..You pair Holts route running expertise with the speed we have at the wideout spots already and they are gonna be even more dangerous…..With that being said and from what ive heard about Martz and him being a perfectionist The receivers are gonna run it til they get it right so it is entirely possible the repetition of doing it over and over again might work also…I still think someone who knows the system will enhance the process
Kobe isnt good....He's just better than your favorite player
Tory Holt Minus the Speed?
Earl Bennet.
You're being very Un-Dude right now.
by IslandBoodler87 on Mar 22, 2010 8:15 AM CDT reply actions
Earl bennet didn't look as slow as everyone likes to say he is....
at least to me he didn’t
Do or do not there is not try-Master Yoda
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