Chicago Bears Position Battles: OL

by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Sep 3, 2010 10:00 AM CDT in Xfinity Sponsored Posts

BOURBONNAIS IL - JULY 30: (L-R) Tim Walter #64 Lance Louis #60 and James Marten #72 of the Chicago Bears work out during a summer training camp practice at Olivet Nazarene University on July 30 2010 in Bourbonnais Illinois. (Photo by Jonathan Daniel/Getty Images)

The Bears had their offensive line set before last night's game. The guys playing the line can play themselves out of a job through some penalties or missed assignments, but it's so hard to make a big final impression and come on strong to make a team when playing in the offensive trenches. Last night they didn't learn anything about their group that they didn't already know.

The starting five will be the same starting five. They'll try and sneak the same guys through to the practice squad, and they'll cut the guys they were planning on cutting.

Chris Williams, Roberto Garza, Olin Kreutz, Lance Louis, and Frank Omiyale are your 2010 starting offensive line. And they looked bad as a group this preseason. It's a new system with a plethora of protection schemes, and who really knows what schemes they unveiled in these four practice games. All we know is they gave up too many sacks. The Bears will only go as far as their offensive line allows them to go.

For sure backups are Josh Beekman, Kevin Shaffer, and Johan Asiata. Although Beekman must have felt a little uneasy when the Bears signed G/C Edwin Williams a couple days ago. And Asiata hasn't had the same kind of buzz surrounding him since his earlier camp work. Shaffer is a good swing tackle and is capable of stepping in at RT if Omiyale falters.

I think they like James Martens ability to play guard and tackle and I think they love the upside of rookie J'Marcus Webb and fear losing him if they try and sneak him through waivers. That makes 10 on the O-Line. Will they keep 10? I don't think they can. Last year they only kept eight. Martens might be the odd man out unless Webb strains his hammy getting off the team bus. I can see them going with nine on the O-Line, then again, with how shaky the group has looked, Jerry Angelo might bring a late veteran cut in from another team to fill out the line. If they do go with only eight, who's next on the chopping block?

The aforementioned Williams is a prime candidate for the P.S. as referenced here. As are rookies Tim Walter (C) and Levi Horn (T).

This will be the last in my series looking at the position groups. I'm skipping QB, my best guess is Jay Cutler, Todd Collins, and Caleb Hanie all stick, with Dan LeFevour making it to the P.S., and I'll pass on the special teams with Robbie Gould, Brad Maynard, and the great Patrick Mannelly who are all money.

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Comments

Isn't most of the "battles"...

for positions on this o-line like a contest to find the tallest midget?!? This unit may actually be worse than last year; and that’s with the “best” o-line guy in the business.

IT'S NOT TOO LATE TO FIRE LOVIE!

by LostInSTL on Sep 3, 2010 10:19 AM CDT reply actions

like a contest to find the tallest midget?!?

It would be a tie between all the ones who are 4’10", according to the Little People of America website FAQ.

"44 years of football history and nothing to show for it. I wish I wasn’t banned at the Norseman.." - tfrabotta
"Fellas, what are they, unblockable? Is that the '85 Bears over there?" - overheard at Giants' '06 training camp
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by Spongie on Sep 3, 2010 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions

I was encouraged by Lance Louis.

He still is raw…

… But, he has the potential to be a good offensive guard in the NFL. He’s HUGE, he’s strong, he’s got good feet and he is mean.

I liked what I saw from him these preseason games, but I think he is one year away from being a quality OL.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 10:32 AM CDT reply actions

This is the most ENCOURAGING thing I got from this OL Position Battle

‘’In the old days, when you had free agency, they would only pay the tackle,’’ Angelo said. ’’They’re all making big money on the offensive line now.

’’There’s a reason. It’s a supply-and-demand business. Offensive linemen are a premium, but it’s not like you have to have five all-stars at the position. You’ve got to get five guys who are good enough to play well together.’’

Jerry Angelo has HISTORICALLY sought his OL through 1.) FA or 2.) late-round draft picks.

In 2008, he took a different approach (some might say out of “necessity”) with the addition of 1st rd draft pick Chris Williams (personally, I liked and was championing for USC’s Sam Baker who is with the Falcons).

I think Angelo sees the folly in his logic for so long and understands that you can’t just “plug” raw talent in starting lineup and expect them to perform (i.e.- Rex Grossman). Nor, can you expect an immediate impact from a late round pick all the time (i.e.— Al Afalava).

I think for SO LONG Jerry Angelo honestly believed that he was smarter than he really is as a scout of talent and recently with new additions to the personnel division he has learned that he is not. Warren Sapp said LONG ago that Jerry Angelo is overrated.

I am glad he has grasped the idea that you need to get more than raw athleticism in your drafts…

… you need actual talent too!

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 10:48 AM CDT reply actions

I feel im going to start a fire but...

I dont see a Angelo or Smith going anywhere after 2010. I think they’ll give them one more year so they dont have to pay them.
And Im ok with that.
I mean for some reason i still like this team and dont realy hate the management.
I feel the tampa 2 sucks but maybe Smith can come up with a new 4-3 D. the most important thing in any 4-3 D is the LBS and we have an outstanding group.
Does any one know any other 4-3 D besides Tampa 2 that the Bears can use?
Anyway i think they stay another year and Angelo will get hopefuly a good 2011 draft.

"Serious sport has nothing to do with fair play. It is bound up with hatred, jealousy, boastfulness, disregard of all rules and sadistic pleasure in witnessing violence. In other words, it is war minus the shooting." - George Orwell

by RoyRockNRoll on Sep 3, 2010 11:48 AM CDT reply actions

That is the problem

Lovie is “confident” in his scheme and will not change it (he has stated it multiple times). That means no change and either Lovie admitting he cannot run it successful and getting a big time DC to shake it up and allowing the new guy to run it his way, not Lovies.

Next problem would be personnel. JA and Lovie have built this unit to fit into the Tampa 2 scheme. Smaller and faster. Smaller does not translate well into other schemes. I am sure there are some but none stick out in my mind.

Then you would also have the learning curve. A new D-scheme will take time to learn. Our veterans have had the same scheme, some since they have been here. Something about teaching old dogs new tricks.

While I would love to see a scheme change I am not confident it will happen and even less confident should Lovie stay around. The Angelo’s ability to recognize talent comes to mind when looking for players to fit a completely new scheme also. Which would mean significant trades and a good draft.

by TheMan1 on Sep 3, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions

Lovie is "confident" in his scheme and will not change it (he has stated it multiple times)

In Lovie’s defense though, he has told Angelo the scheme he runs and Angelo is supposed to deliver him the personnel to fill it.

If you look at the “must have’s” in terms of personnel for any C2 system (a sideline-to-sideline MLB, a good front 4, and hard-hitting sure tackling safties) the Bears have not had all of these elements in unison since 2005 into 2006.

Some of that is Lovie’s staff inability to coach players into the next level of their career, but a lot of that rests on Jerry Angelo’s draft picks and FA signings.

A carpenter is only as good as his/her tools and Lovie Smith has been saddled with some pretty disappointing talent up until recent. Dan Bazuin, Kevin Payne, Danieal Manning, and the “always broken” Dusty Dvorachek does not help fill your roster with talent and competition— especially when your GM needs these picks to stay on roster for his own “job security”.

Coaching decisions aside, I think there are a lot of reasons one can say the Bears C2 is inefficient— not just stubborness to change (although I do agree that there is certainly a problem with adapting to an opposing team’s gameplan).

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions

Regarding Angelo

I think his biggest problem with drafting is wanting/trying to outsmart everybody else. He always seems to make that pick that makes everybody scratch their head. I firmly believe that’s why the likes of Bazuin, Okwo, Wolfe, etc. are picked, so Angelo can make himself out to look like some kind of genius if they pan out.

Also, EVERY single year it seems like we draft somebody with an injury history/major injury that the “experts” say is a great pickup/first round talent and we’re getting a steal IF they can bounce back.

I honestly cannot wait to see his ass get fired. I’ve stated before I’m a fan of Lovie’s, but Angelo is just an ass that needs to get the boot real quick like.

WILDCARD BITCHES!!! YEEEEHHHAAAAA!!!!!

by Acreman20 on Sep 3, 2010 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

This ^

rec’d for truth!

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions

I'd wreck this but 2 things...

1) You forgot killer pool jumping abilities

2) They haven’t allowed rec’s on mobile yet

by TheMan1 on Sep 3, 2010 8:33 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions

Ah....

How could I forget pool jumping skills?

WILDCARD BITCHES!!! YEEEEHHHAAAAA!!!!!

by Acreman20 on Sep 3, 2010 11:00 PM CDT up reply actions

IDK

But I heard the NFL is adding it to the combine next year for its direct translation to talent in the NFL

by TheMan1 on Sep 3, 2010 11:56 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions

Pool Jumping is in the combine now?

Five foot three seems to thrive on his misery...

by awfullyquiet on Sep 4, 2010 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions

He's kidding...

:] I hope you know…

"A lot of fans were drawn to me because they knew that whatever the score was, I was going to run as hard as I could on every play. You don't have that now, you have guys waiting for next week or even next year." - Walter Payton

Editor/Writer for WindyCityGridiron.com

by Ashley Czuba on Sep 4, 2010 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions

The most important thing is:

Pressure from the front four is almost paramount to the lovie-2 defense. Because with that, you allow your linebackers to make plays up the center through contain, contain, contain… The faster, more reactive, the linebackers though are, the better. But, really, it ALL boils down to how much penetration can your D-Line produce, and how well can you’re LB’s tackle once you recognize the run. Without an impressive D-Line, you have no hope of having your LB’s carry the team, because the scheme shouldn’t call for a tremendous amount of blitzing because of the weakenesses in the zone constructions. Sporatically yes. But, as you’ve seen probably over the past 2 years. The more you blitz, the harder it is to contain the big play. The quicker your DL can either contain the run or get to the passer, the better your LB’s and DB’s can play (aside: sitting 7 off the line doesn’t help in 3rd and 7 situations). The weaknesses inherent in the Lovie-2 is… it’s not great at stopping the run with good run blocking. The linebackers have to stick to their gaps and hope for the opposing RB to poorly hit the hole. It should be better against the pass and against the deep ball (because you have two safeties, generally, playing center field and keeping the ball in front of them, as opposed to, what we have more often, which is a SS sitting next to the SLB who can’t backpedal enough to keep the whomever in front of him (wr, te). We’re talking ‘base’ package here though, which, admittedly, we only sit in variants of cover 2 and cover 3, half the time.

Five foot three seems to thrive on his misery...

by awfullyquiet on Sep 3, 2010 5:40 PM CDT up reply actions

Have you seen how often Peppers and Izzey have been in the backfield this preseason?

It has been “consistently” often.

Yet, the CBs are so far off the receiver that it doesn’t matter how fast they get in…

… As long as the QB reads the coverage and gets rid of the ball before they get to him. It’s happened all preseason. Colt McCoy was a prime example last night.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 6:33 PM CDT up reply actions

Aye, on the CB's

We’re talking though ‘schemes’, not playcalling. The playcalling is wack in regards to CB’s… the way it should work, is as is above…

No amount of defensive pressure will compensate for quick slants if you play constantly 7 yards off the line.

Five foot three seems to thrive on his misery...

by awfullyquiet on Sep 4, 2010 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions

But that's because of a "lack of talent"; not scheme

Look at Rivera’s defense or the Jets defense and you will see that teams with talented CBs are able to play man-to-man coverage and bump receivers off routes and allow that extra bit of time for the DL to get to the QB.

The DL is not the problem, nor the scheme…

… Its the lack of talent in the secondary.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 4, 2010 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions

Angelo

Couldn’t agree more. This guy has had 1 1st rd pick work out during his time here and that’s Olsen 3 years ago. More than time to get a new regime in here and change the culture.

by walterfan34 on Sep 3, 2010 2:37 PM CDT reply actions

But we are going to trade him for a 4th

Well that’s what some people think

by TheMan1 on Sep 3, 2010 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

MEEEEE! :-)

Olsen’s success is very debateable. No right or wrong answer, in my opinion.

My opinion is that he is overrated in Chicago. Go through all 32 teams in the NFL and I bet you there are 10 better than him as-of-today.

Does that mean he stinks? No.

My argument is that he is not a TE in Mike Martz system— which he is not! Martz is using him in the mold of a WR that can play on and off the line. Innovative.

But, how do you pay a player like that? We have seen when you pay players who really don’t fit the role they are in (i.e.— Devin Hester).

I just think you can trade Olsen this season and get something for him, before he leaves on his own to go to a team that will use him in more of a traditional TE formation.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 6:37 PM CDT up reply actions

Oh, yeah...Almost forgot.

Rec’d for snark. ;-)

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 3, 2010 6:38 PM CDT up reply actions

I agree

That Olsen isn’t a traditional Martz TE. His blocking looks like it has improved, but nobody is going to mistake him as a third offensive tackle.

However, if Martz is the offensive guru everybody claims him to be, he will find a way to use Olsen consistently and effectively. I just don’t want to waste another very talented player by letting him walk next year or trading him for next to nothing this year.

It’s not set in stone that Martz will even be here next season.

WILDCARD BITCHES!!! YEEEEHHHAAAAA!!!!!

by Acreman20 on Sep 3, 2010 7:26 PM CDT up reply actions

So who's to say what he gets paid?

If nothing else we offer a mid-range TE salary and see if it sticks. If he is not top 20 material then don’t pay him that. Worst that happens is we have a TE threat for the next 2 years or trade next year. Unfortuntely estimating salaries from our GM is something I have less faith in than me killing of a keg before week 5 this year.

Shoot they paid out the wazu for Mamalamadingdong who is injured and served no purpose except to be an additional OL. Crap for what they paid him we could have Atogwe sitting at corner this year.

by TheMan1 on Sep 3, 2010 8:43 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions